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Existing Rental Cabins

Discussion in 'Existing Buildings Codes' started by north star, Aug 16, 2018.

  1. north star

    north star Sawhorse

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    @ ~ @

    I have some project plans where there will be some Level 1
    [ from the 2015 IEBC ] work being performed on some rental
    cabins near a lake........FWIW, these cabins are located on a
    federal military installation.

    One of the existing cabins is designated as ADA equipped.
    At this one cabin, it is being proposed to remove the existing,
    wooden guard-railing, vertical pickets and horizontal top railing
    and replace with horizontal metal strands [ complying with the
    applicable structural loads ].

    QUESTION # 1: How should the rental cabins be identified

    [ i.e. - R-1, R-2, R-3, etc. ] ?

    QUESTION # 2: Because part of the hand-railing is being replaced,

    does this now qualify as new construction and subject to the
    requirements of the applicable `15 IBC, ...the `17 A117.1 &
    the `10 ADASAD [ i.e. - the requirement for hand-railing ] ?

    Thanks for your input !


    @ ~ @
     
  2. RLGA

    RLGA Sawhorse

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    Group R-3. New work shall comply with the current code (IEBC Section 702.6).

    The 2017 ANSI is not referenced by the 2015 IBC--only the 2009.
     
    north star likes this.
  3. north star

    north star Sawhorse

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    % = % = %

    Much Thanks Ron ! ;)

    % = % = %
     
  4. Paul Sweet

    Paul Sweet Sawhorse

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    Also check with the base commander to see if the service amends the codes to use UFAS or ADAAG instead of ANSI A117.1.
     
    north star likes this.
  5. RLGA

    RLGA Sawhorse

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  6. north star

    north star Sawhorse

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    # = # = #

    Much Thanks Paul ! ;) FWIW, ...the Base Commander will
    not have a clue in this instance.......Our office will be the AHJ,
    and thus, we will be interpreting the "required" Codes &
    Standards that are applicable.

    As I understand it, the applicable Codes & Standards are the
    `15 Edition of the I-Codes, ...the `10 ADASAD [ for new construction ]
    and, as Mr. Ron has pointed out, ...the `09 A117.1.......No UFAS
    or ABA.


    = # = # =
     
  7. RLGA

    RLGA Sawhorse

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    If it's on military property (i.e. DoD property), then why wouldn't the ABA be applicable?
     
  8. north star

    north star Sawhorse

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    # ~ $ ~ #

    The military installation in question is not a true DoD facility.
    It is a military training facility in the Southeastern U.S.,
    on mostly State owned property.

    No one in authority has ever mentioned use of the ABA.

    So, if the ABA is applicable, that would be 4 Accessibility Standards
    to apply [ i.e. - `09 A117.1, ...the `10 ADASAD, ...[ possibly ] Ch. 11
    in the `15 IBC, and the ABA ] ?


    # ~ $ ~ #
     
  9. RLGA

    RLGA Sawhorse

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    Possibly. Actually, IBC Chapter 11 provides the scoping requirements for ANSI A117.1, much like the second chapters provide for each the ADA and ABA standards; thus, really only three standards.

    If it's leased property, but DoD-built buildings, then I would think the ABA standards would still apply and not the ADA standards. However, the two are so comparable, that complying with one should not be that difficult to comply with the other.

    There is a combined document (2004 ADA-ABA Standards) published by the Access Board (https://www.access-board.gov/guidelines-and-standards/buildings-and-sites/about-the-ada-standards/background/ada-aba-accessibility-guidelines-2004) that has both standards. It provides separate scoping chapters for each, but the technical requirements for both are the same. The DoJ, in their 2010 ADA Standards, just published the ADA portion.

    If the buildings are leased, then scoping requirements for the ABA has a section on leased property, which is limited compliance. If just the land is leased and the DoD built the structures, then I would say that the ABA standards are applicable.
     
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  10. ADAguy

    ADAguy Sawhorse

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    The quandary here is you have a choice, stay with ABA or go with 2010 ADASAD for this and all future alterations.
     
  11. Sleepy

    Sleepy Registered User

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    DoD uses the 2015 version of ABA Standards (which oddly says it was adopted in 2008), available here:
    https://www.access-board.gov/attachments/article/1029/ABAstandards.pdf
    One change is that it does include provisions for outdoor developed areas which may be relevant.

    The way to trace this is to look at UFC 1-200-01 which is the DoD Building Code, available here:
    http://wbdg.org/FFC/DOD/UFC/ufc_1_200_01_2016_c1.pdf
    The UFC invokes the 2015 IBC and 2015 IEBC with modifications. One of the modifications is to not use Chapter 11 of IBC but instead use the ABA Standards.
     
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  12. ADAguy

    ADAguy Sawhorse

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    Thank you for this specific point.
     
  13. north star

    north star Sawhorse

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    @ ~ @

    Also, a "Thank You" **Sleepy** for the clarification. ;)

    @ ~ @
     
  14. north star

    north star Sawhorse

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    + + &

    ...continuing with the discussion on this same topic.

    In all of the lake-front cabins planned for renovations \
    alterations [ Level 1 ], ...in reviewing the submitted plans,
    I have noticed that there aren't any Exhaust Fans in
    any of the existing Bathrooms, nor are any planned to
    be installed. :confused:


    QUESTION: Are Exhaust Fans "required" to be installed
    in these Transient Lodging facilities ?.....NOTE: There are
    plans to replace the outdated HVAC systems with more
    energy efficient systems, just no Exhaust Fans.

    I am using the `15 I-Codes, ...the `10 ADASAD, ...the
    `09 A117.1 & the ABA..........May I also please request
    that you cite your Codes or Standards references.


    Thanks for your input ! :)


    & & +
     
  15. mtlogcabin

    mtlogcabin Sawhorse

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    IEBC
    SECTION 707
    ENERGY CONSERVATION

    707.1 Minimum requirements.
    Level 1 alterations to existing buildings or structures are permitted without requiring the entire building or structure to comply with the energy requirements of the International Energy Conservation Code or International Residential Code. The alterations shall conform to the energy requirements of the International Energy Conservation Code or International Residential Code as they relate to new construction only.


    IRC

    TABLE M1507.4
    MINIMUM REQUIRED LOCAL EXHAUST RATES FOR
    ONE- AND TWO-FAMILY DWELLINGS


    AREA TO BE EXHAUSTED EXHAUST RATES
    Kitchens 100 cfm intermittent or 25 cfm continuous
    Bathrooms-Toilet Rooms Mechanical exhaust capacity of 50 cfm intermittent or 20 cfm continuous
     
  16. north star

    north star Sawhorse

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    @ ~ @

    Thank you **mtlogcabin** !

    @ ~ @
     
  17. Paul Sweet

    Paul Sweet Sawhorse

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    Exhaust fans might not be required if the bathrooms have operable windows.
     
  18. mtlogcabin

    mtlogcabin Sawhorse

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    I can't find that exception anymore. Instead I find the energy codes requirement of a blower door test and air changes not exceeding 5 air changes per hour requiring mechanical ventilation

    R402.4.1.2 Testing.
    The building or dwelling unit shall be tested and verified as having an air leakage rate of not exceeding 5 air changes per hour in Climate Zones 1 and 2, and 3 air changes per hour in Climate Zones 3 through 8. Testing shall be conducted with a blower door at a pressure of 0.2 inches w.g. (50 Pascals). Where required by the code official, testing shall be conducted by an approved third party. A written report of the results of the test shall be signed by the party conducting the test and provided to the code official. Testing shall be performed at any time after creation of all penetrations of the building thermal envelope

    R303.4 Mechanical ventilation.
    Where the air infiltration rate of a dwelling unit is less than 5 air changes per hour when tested with a blower door at a pressure of 0.2 inch w.c (50 Pa) in accordance with Section N1102.4.1.2, the dwelling unit shall be provided with whole-house mechanical ventilation in accordance with Section M1507.3.
     
  19. ADAguy

    ADAguy Sawhorse

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    Energy savings again, an unintended consequence, we all need fresh air.
     
  20. Paul Sweet

    Paul Sweet Sawhorse

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    2015 IRC R303.3 still requires bathrooms to have 3 SF of glazing and half of it to be operable, unless artificial light and a local exhaust are provided.
     
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