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Garbage Disposals at Kitchen Sinks

Yikes said:
Mark, I'll take the bait: 1133A.4.1, item 2 says "Base cabinets directly under the kitchen sink and work surfaces shall be removable to provide clearance for a wheelchair".Now, I readily concede that when read exactly:

1) The actual words are about the cabinet, not the sink in the countertop above the cabinet.

2) The clearance is for a "wheelchair", not for knee or toe space for the user of the wheelchair.

3) There is no stated maximum height of countertop, only that it must reposition down to a minimum of 28" above finish floor.

Having said that, it would appear the *intent* is for a person to be able to roll under the sink, which would then imply, for a typical 36" maximum high counter, that there's a limit to the bowl depth.
There is no bait.

There are no clearances specified in the CBC for kitchen sinks.

I agree the intent is there, but not the letter of the Code.

The fair housing guidelines show a figure with the dispoal in the space.
 
Thanks, Mark. This may work for the units now, but the 2013 CBC will require the knee and toe space clearance below the kitchen sink.

$260 is cheap, the Assure sink is running around $1000.
 
chickadee said:
Thanks, Mark. This may work for the units now, but the 2013 CBC will require the knee and toe space clearance below the kitchen sink.$260 is cheap, the Assure sink is running around $1000.
And we will find a solution by then....
 
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Yikes said:
Welcome to the board. FYI, Mark handler will probably have the best and final word on this.Meanwhile:

If this was inside an apartment unit, you would use chapter 11A. However, since is for a community room, you should refer to both chapter 11B and ADA for compliance.

Per 1117B.9, knee clearance needs to extend 19” under sinks.

I don’t think there is an exception for side approach. this is more strict than 11A or UFAS, FHA, etc.

Kohler makes a sink called “Assure” that has the disposal way at the back, for knee clearance.

http://www.us.kohler.com/webassets/kpna/catalog/pdf/en/113824_4.pdf

Elkay also makes a sink LRAD250 with one drain offset to the back, but I don’t know if that will definitely get you what you need: Elkay Commercial Products
Update 8/26/13: I followed my own advice to the original poster. For a community room in my own project, I'm specifying an Elkay LRAD250 with a 4 1/2" deep bowl on the disposal side (the one with the drain far to the back). An ISE Badger 1 disposal is 6" diameter.

I did the math, and a 33 7/8" high counter, 25" deep, with the sink rim jammed back against the face of a max 3/4" thick backsplash, will still get me all of the clearances under/in front of the disposal as required by ADA and CBC Fig. 11B-1D with about 1/2" to spare. All this is in a stainless steel sink that still looks somewhat conventional and homey (unlike the Kohler sink described above).
 
Fort, I use that Elkay inside the apartments. however, the drain holes seem too far forward to be able to install a garbage disposal and still have the code-required knee and toe clearance underneath the disposal for a forward approach. So we use it only inside dwelling units, where a side approach is allowed.
 
Hey there. I'm now thinking my new kitchen ideas over and need a piece of advice :) I agree that plastic is by no means a good idea for the outdoor kitchen. What did you use? wood? and company of kitchen faucets is best?
 
Ah, the web we weave, perpendicular approach to sinks is preferred over side approach as it allows for use of either hand. Parallel requires ability to approach from either side, can you?
 
Also, don't forget that the forward approach knee clearance described in 11B-306.3 is only required in the first 11" from face of counter, and after that you only need 9" of toe clearance for 17" depth.
This may be tight if you were trying to put a garbage disposal under a 17" deep lavatory! But under a 24-25" deep kitchen sink, you've got lots of wiggle room.
In other words, for a typical 25" deep sink cabinet countertop, the rear 14" of the cabinet could easily have the garbage disposal in it, with 9" to spare for the toe kick..
 
Sorry ADAguy, but I don't think there is a code requirement that parallel approach must be from either side.
Nice to have it - -but not a requirement.
UPDATE: since this thread was started in 2013, two things have changed:
1. 1133A.3 now explicitly requires "knee and toe clearance" for the base cabinet, which I assume is per fig. 11A-9D (a) and (b). However, in the tehcnical wording, the focus is entirely about the cabinet being removable. It does not say that knee and toe space must be provided.
2. I have had several CASPs agree with ADAguy in post #36: although it does not explicitly state it in the code, these CASPs believe the intent is for a parallel sink approach from either direction, so that if a person is missing wither their right or left hand/arm, they can still reach the faucet, etc.

Question: if a designer chooses a parallel approach instead of a front approach in 1133A2.2, why would the cabinets need to be removable?
 
Understand that not all WC users can rotate to the right or left, governed by the nature of their disability, perpendicular approach provides for the majority of users to use the sink. The space must be available at all times without additional effort to "remove" a panel.
The drain is typically located in the center of most sinks unless specified otherwise. This is an often overlooked item when specifying accessible sinks.
 
And understand when you can use a side approach. No cooking appliances can be present or a front roll under approach is required. We typically specify a single bowl rear centered drain and use a garbage disposal. Maybe one jurisdiction has mentioned something but it seems to have been accepted nearly everywhere. I think they typically look at it similarly to the drain overflow that can encroach in the clear space.
 
On a side track anyone here from VT? I just heard in VT composting in mandatory for everyone. Are garbage disposals banned or are you just not allowed to use them?
 
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