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bond pool fence?

Mr. Inspector

Mr. Inspector

SAWHORSE
Joined
Nov 28, 2009
Messages
4,100
Location
Poconos/eastern PA
I was told that a metal fence within 10' of the pool must be bonded. I can't find this in the IRC or NEC. The closest thing to it I can find is 680.26(B)(3) all metallic parts of the pool structure shall be bonded. Can anyone help me with this?
 
We are on the 2002, and we use 680.26(B)(5) which says within 5 feet. We also require bonding if the metal posts are embedded in the reinforced pool deck or walk regardless of distance.

Even though we deleted the electrical sections out of the IRC, in the 2006 IRC you would be looking at E4104.2(6).
 
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2009 4204.5 Any metal within 5' of a indoor hot tub must be bonded. Does anyone know why this is required but a pool or an outside hot tub it is not required?
 
Hmmm..nice Rick....this is informative for me! please keep it up! and whats about the

glass fence in the same cases...

regards
 
A wrought iron fence <5' has been installed as the result of a correction. During a re-roof inspection it was noticed that the pool had no barrier.

I initially placed the correction notice and a handout on pool barriers on the front door and didn't get a response for five months. H/O calls for final on the roof and here we are.

The pool is gunite with 3' concrete surround. 40 years old with a 15 year old remodel.

There is no evidence of a bonding grid. I cant find a wire coming out anywhere around the equipment and the equipment has not been relocated.

So what does the fence bond to?

What did code require when the pool was first approved? {curious about the what/when but that can't strictly apply}

The owner is upset with himself for not asking questions before he built the fence and is not in a good mood. He also has heath issues and his father passed away recently. I would classify his psyche as fragile, as in, he could snap at any time.

Ultimately, safety is the goal and code wise, I think I can require a bonding grid. The introduction of the fence triggered the code thusly: Per NEC, a fence <5' shall be bonded to the bonding grid. I can't enforce the code without the grid. Therefor, a grid shall be provided in that he shall bust concrete and bond to pool steel, deck steel and the pump.

That sounds like a rigid application of the code and a back-door way to use it. Especially since this was born from a re-roof permit.

The property is well kept and in a nice neighborhood. I may be able to convince h/o that it is in his best interest. That's called finesse. I don't drag it out for just anybody but he is fragile. If I can get him to ask for it, the bonding grid will magically appear.

So if my finesse turns out to be BS...If this guy turns on me...well there is the code.

Do you see any holes I might step in? Opinions? Something I've missed?
 
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If you are going to finesse it, maybe you could present him with another option: move the fence.
 
TimNY said:
If you are going to finesse it, maybe you could present him with another option: move the fence.
Click to expand...
I thought about that during the inspection and didn't mention it. I got the feeling that would have increased his fragility exponentially. This is an expensive fence and features of his landscaping would make the job difficult so it was a non-starter for me. Cost wise, it would be too much as opposed to a grid.

He would have a story to tell though. The time the building dept made him build his fence twice.
 
I screwed up and put this post in another thread at ResElec and now i will get answers at both places. I figured it needed a post of it's own. Live and learn.

Nobody has posted there so if a moderator sees this perhaps you could delete it there at Res Elec.
 
ICE,

Can you come up with an alternative design that requires very minimal "breaking

up of the concrete", ...say, some type of an "after thought" type of compliant grid?

Maybe some of the more experienced, electrically knowledged folks on here can

submit some type of design for you.

In the interest of "not beating up" [ figurativel speaking ] more on the fragile

homeowner, IMO, I would try my darnedest to come up up with some type

compliant design that did not disrupt further his life. I see this as an excellent

opportunity for you to perform some "above and beyond" customer service

from his government service.

We ARE all about service to the public aren't we ?

Who knows, you may even get a "thank you" out of it.

FWIW, that's one of the great things about construction work. Even if things

seem permanent, there are still "fixes" for the "after-the-concrete-has-been

-poured-and-hardend" type of problem. Sometimes, one has to look a

little harder for the solution.

Have you got it solved yet? :D

.
 
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globe trekker said:
ICE,Can you come up with an alternative design that requires very minimal "breaking

up of the concrete", ...say, some type of an "after thought" type of compliant grid?

Maybe some of the more experienced, electrically knowledged folks on here can

submit some type of design for you.

In the interest of "not beating up" [ figurativel speaking ] more on the fragile

homeowner, IMO, I would try my darnedest to come up up with some type

compliant design that did not disrupt further his life. I see this as an excellent

opportunity for you to perform some "above and beyond" customer service

from his government service.

We ARE all about service to the public aren't we ?

Who knows, you may even get a "thank you" out of it.

FWIW, that's one of the great things about construction work. Even if things

seem permanent, there are still "fixes" for the "after-the-concrete-has-been

-poured-and-hardend" type of problem. Sometimes, one has to look a

little harder for the solution.

Have you got it solved yet? :D

.
Click to expand...
I sent an e-mail to the chief el engr. It was a copy of what I wrote here. Still waiting to hear from him. As to creating an "after thought" grid. The existing pool steel etc is already a code prescribed component of a pool bonding grid. By code I think it must be included if we set out to create a grid.
 
I have been away from work for two weeks and when I got there today, there was message from the h/o. The message read, "I grounded the fence and the pump motor". When I called him, he explained the he has driven 5 ground rods and attached 4 to the fence and 1 to the pump motor.

Before I went on leave, I told him that I would not have an answer for 2 weeks. So the nervous Nelly couldn't wait for that and spent a bunch of money for nothing. Then an explanation was in order. I hope he took notes.
 
Rick18071 said:
No ground rod allowed!
Click to expand...
I told him to disconnect the rod from the pump now. The rods at the fence are not a concern unless lightning strikes in the vicinity and he is touching the fence. He has now told me that he is going to move the fence back, way back and encompass most of his yard.
 
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