240.24(D) Not in Vicinity of Easily Ignitible Material. Overcurrent devices shall not be located in the vicinity of easily ignitible material, such as in clothes closets.
Violation 240.24 makes it clear with an example of " such as close closets"Pcinspector1 said:R2 group apartment, plans have the breaker boxes inside the coat closets. If they meet the required height, width and depth would it be allowed? pc1
Gregg I quoted that section also but I gotta tell you it is not clear. It states such as clothes closets but it doesn't say they cannot be in a clothes closet if there are no combustibles around the panel.Gregg Harris said:Violation 240.24 makes it clear with an example of " such as close closets"
2008 NEC is when Clothes Closet was added to the definitions to help clarify 240.24(D) and by looking at 410.2 under the storage section of a closet helps to clarify if there is dedicated space for a panel.Dennis said:Gregg I quoted that section also but I gotta tell you it is not clear. It states such as clothes closets but it doesn't say they cannot be in a clothes closet if there are no combustibles around the panel.FWIW, this question was asked a few years ago to a member of the cmp- code making panel- and his response was that it did not exclude clothes closets and specifically stated if it were on an adjacent wall to the door where the door would swing up against it or on the other adjacent wall then he saw no issues with it. I think it was Jeff Sargent - one of the authors of the NEC handbook.
410.2 has no bearing what so ever on 240.24(D). The definitions that are located in a .2 section of a specific article only apply to the article in which they are referenced.Gregg Harris said:2008 NEC is when Clothes Closet was added to the definitions to help clarify 240.24(D) and by looking at 410.2 under the storage section of a closet helps to clarify if there is dedicated space for a panel.
Just to clarify, I don't believe Jeff Sargent is a code panel member but is employed by NFPA as a staff engineer and author of the NEC Handbook.Dennis said:Gregg I quoted that section also but I gotta tell you it is not clear. It states such as clothes closets but it doesn't say they cannot be in a clothes closet if there are no combustibles around the panel.FWIW, this question was asked a few years ago to a member of the cmp- code making panel- and his response was that it did not exclude clothes closets and specifically stated if it were on an adjacent wall to the door where the door would swing up against it or on the other adjacent wall then he saw no issues with it. I think it was Jeff Sargent - one of the authors of the NEC handbook.
I don't think that there will be a space available in a coat closet that is not within the vicinity of coats. It has been pointed out that there are ways to place a panel in a closet but that is limited to a closet that has a wall that will not be in the vicinity easily ignitable material such as behind a door. That's not going to happen often without prior planning.Pcinspector1 said:R2 group apartment, plans have the breaker boxes inside the coat closets. If they meet the required height, width and depth would it be allowed? pc1
I believe you are correct. He is on the engineering technical staff of the NFPA.raider1 said:Just to clarify, I don't believe Jeff Sargent is a code panel member but is employed by NFPA as a staff engineer and author of the NEC Handbook.Chris
Now that is funny!!jim baird said:PC,I can't imagine a licensed DP issuing plans for such arrangement.
raider,'"raider1 said:410.2 has no bearing what so ever on 240.24(D). The definitions that are located in a .2 section of a specific article only apply to the article in which they are referenced.Also the definition of clothes closet does not affect 240.24(D) directly, as Dennis has pointed out 240.24(D) does not specifically state that a panel can't be installed within a clothes closet just that it can't be installed in the vicinity of easily ignitable material.
Chris
It does not say that at all. It can be taken many ways. It simple states that overcurrent devices shall not be located in the vicinity of easily ignitable material, such as in clothes closets. The easily ignitable materials are in clothes clothes but not all areas of the closet have this material in the vicinity.codeworks said:as. a licensed electriciain and inspector, the example is quite clear (240-24 (E) shall not be located.........in clothes closets.
I have no clear cut distance I just know it when I see it.pwood said:raider,'"what do you use as a definitive distance for" vicinity"? 1',2',3',4',5'?, i find it easier to not allow them in the vicinity of a clothes closet.:mrgreen: