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Guard & Deck Issues on a Green Building Forum

tbz

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Sep 10, 2010
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Was looking for some information on another subject today and ran across this post about a Guard on a deck.

The forum charges 150 a year to join, not my cup of tea, but when your in an area with no inspections look what transpires

Have a great day everyone & enjoy Glenn....

 

Pcinspector1

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Looks like a combination of a USP A3 and a Simpson BC60 Z? with colored deck screws, but I'm looking from afar!
 

Sleepy

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A total horror story, really. You'd have to question work on the entire house.
 
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Glenn

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We have a long way to go in this country to get people to take decks more seriously.
 

Glenn

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We need a "deck Czar!" Someone that collects building code books and makes improvements to the code, I guy that knows stuff!:)
I search for grants for deck safety research all the time, but it's just not trendy enough for people to invest in it. Lots of financial support is available for affordable housing, green construction, and energy conservation. It's ridiculous how little support there is for this subject that has been so long ignored.
 

Rick18071

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Poconos/eastern PA
We got a swimming pool code book and a sunroom code book maybe we should have a deck code book or standard with other prescriptive designs for free standing, more then one beam, joists parallel with the building and roof decks. Or let us go by the deck guide that the AWC made. A home owner could just get this to build a deck and not need to buy the whole IRC.
 

tbz

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Messages
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PA/NJ - Borderlands
I search for grants for deck safety research all the time, but it's just not trendy enough for people to invest in it. Lots of financial support is available for affordable housing, green construction, and energy conservation. It's ridiculous how little support there is for this subject that has been so long ignored.
Glenn,

Revise the grant request focusing on how to design proper decks to meet the Affordable housing, green building and energy conservation requirements within the building code. Then cover it and write what you want and research all the concerns...

Then again as we can see without knowledge we all tend to walk off a cliff now and then.
 

ICE

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Jun 23, 2011
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California concrete jungle
We have a long way to go in this country to get people to take decks more seriously.
Okay Glenn I appreciate that you have found a passion for decks....but here's the deal for us. If the elevation around the deck is less that thirty inches, no permit is required. If greater than thirty inches you not only get a permit but you also get an engineer. I submit that a seperate deck code would be superfluous.……… Now fatboy is wondering what superhero involves flowers.
 
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Glenn

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Okay Glenn I appreciate that you have found a passion for decks....but here's the deal for us. If the elevation around the deck is less that thirty inches, no permit is required. If greater than thirty inches you not only get a permit but you also get an engineer. I submit that a seperate deck code would be superfluous. Now fatboy is wondering what superhero involves flowers.
Okay ICE, I appreciate that you live in one of the most progressive and expensive states in the nation... but here's the deal for us. The country as a whole is like the wild west meets a third world country when it comes to decks and even many engineers have no clue. How could they? The ASCE 7 doesn't even recognize a lateral live load design value, as decks are the only floors without walls for wind loads and mass for seismic. The research completed and published in 2012 revealed that live loads are the greatest lateral loads on decks. How is an engineer to design a structure to resist a load that is unknown and undefined? That's just the tip of the iceberg of issues with decks. American culture thinks decks are something you learn during a Saturday morning Home Depot clinic. "Decks are easy" I've heard that for a long, long time...

Just being a smart ass with my intro sentence. I figured you can handle it. You cracked me up how you made it sound like this is some new thing for me... like I'm in the honeymoon phase. I've been doing decks since I was 19. My passion has become my prison.
 

Glenn

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We got a swimming pool code book and a sunroom code book maybe we should have a deck code book or standard with other prescriptive designs for free standing, more then one beam, joists parallel with the building and roof decks. Or let us go by the deck guide that the AWC made. A home owner could just get this to build a deck and not need to buy the whole IRC.
An IDC (deck code) has been discussed many times. I'm working on some major updates, cleanup and new stuff for the 2024 IRC. As that book continues to grow, something will need to be done on a much larger scale. I wonder if splitting it into two volumes will be the future. One for mandatory requirements and a larger one for all the prescriptive methods. This way in states where design professionals are universally required, those professionals could purchase a much smaller mandatory code volume and find what they need much more easily. God willing, I've got two more decades in this industry, so I'm not afraid to wonder what will happen in that time. Fun stuff. Bar talk with a beer in hand, kind of stuff.

But I already set it up so a homeowner doens't have to buy the whole IRC. My ICC deck construction book provides all the IRC deck codes from 2018 and 2021 including commentary for only $49.99 NADRA members get the same ICC member discount of $39.99

 

Mark K

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May 12, 2010
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ASCE 7does provide wind and seismic forces that the deck needs to resist. The code also defines the force on the top rails around the deck. But if you look to the IRC those criteria seem to get lost.

The homeowner needs to hire an engineer to evaluate the problem and design a fix.
 

Rick18071

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Nov 28, 2009
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3,103
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Poconos/eastern PA
Glenn, since the code has no definition of a porch how do you define it as? And would it need to be built as an deck, addition or a sun room?

[RB] ADDITION. An extension or increase in floor area or
height of a building or structure.

[RB] SUNROOM. A one-story structure attached to a dwelling
with a glazing area in excess of 40 percent of the gross
area of the structure’s exterior walls and roof.
For definition applicable in Chapter 11, see Section
N1101.6.

Balcony. No definition in IRC and IBC which only has sections cantilevered about balconies..

No definition of a deck in the IRC or IBC
 

rktect 1

Gold Member
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Oct 20, 2009
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969
Location
Illinois
Wait, when did a deck that is less than 30 inches high stop needing a permit nor need to be designed and built correctly?

Last time I checked, all landings on the exterior side of a door are a required part of the building codes.
 

steveray

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Nov 25, 2009
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West of the river CT
(Amd) R105.2 Work exempt from permit.
10. Decks not exceeding 200 square feet (18.58 m2) in area, that are not more than 30 inches
(762 mm) above grade at any point, are not attached to a dwelling and do not serve the
exit door required by Section R311.4.
 

Pcinspector1

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I think CA must have something like: R105.2 Work exempt from permit, #10. Decks that are not more than 30 inches above grade to a dwelling and do not serve the exit door required by R311.4.
 

rktect 1

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Illinois
And what about the required landing? Do they just not require the required landing (or step) outside of the rear exterior door at this point when it is less than a 30 inch drop to the ground? Just because you make a landing out of decking material does not remove the requirement for that landing would be my thought process. Since they decided to make the landing out of decking material, it must meet all code requirements, no?
 
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