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PA 2015 IRC - Outlet locations

tbz

tbz

Silver Member
Joined
Sep 10, 2010
Messages
1,250
Location
PA/NJ - Borderlands
OK, you are looking at a main living area,
  • open concept, the wall on the right is bookcases wall to wall and 80" tall,
  • in front of the bookcase is a stair fight to the lower level with a glass guard around the opening,
  • there is one of the European style Round wood stoves going in, though it says future,
  • Question is about wall outlets, were I marked out in blue, are floor outlets required?
    • The bookcases are 19'-0" wide
      • The cove at the top in front of the bookcases is 66" and the return on the glass guard is 44"
      • The long section of glass guard is 10'-0"
      • The wood stove area is 48" square
EOQ.JPG
 
Yes. Granny is going to put her rocking chair on the back side of the stove, and needs a place to plug in her electric blanket.
 
I would agree, not so much about granny.

But yes, I believe a receptacle outlet would be required along the glazed guard, obviously a floor mounted type.

If I had a NEC in front of me a would cite an article section, but I don't.
 
The wood stove and the glass guard might not get along well.

No to the receptacles.
 
Agreed on the bookcase.

But "free-standing bar-type counters or railings." ?

I think that pretty much describes the guard.

JAR, Chris, opinion?

Not wanting to argue for arguments sake, I have made this call in the field before, would like to know if I am off-base with it.
 
ICE said:
No. The glass guard is not a wall space. Neither is the bookcase.
Click to expand...
Respectfully disagree, based on my interpretation of the reason for the requirement. Somebody is going to put an end table there with a lamp, or need to plug in a cell phone charger, or a vacuum cleaner, and you don’t want electrical cords strung across the floor.
 
fatboy said:
Agreed on the bookcase.

But "free-standing bar-type counters or railings." ?

I think that pretty much describes the guard.

JAR, Chris, opinion?

Not wanting to argue for arguments sake, I have made this call in the field before, would like to know if I am off-base with it.
Click to expand...
The guard is not a “fixed room divider” ......as is the counter/railing that you refer to.
 
ICE said:
The guard is not a “fixed room divider” ......as is the counter/railing that you refer to.
Click to expand...
I think it pretty much divides the room from the open stairway.

We've heard from one that is of the same mind as me, let's see what others say.
 
ICE said:
The wood stove and the glass guard might not get along well.

No to the receptacles.
Click to expand...
ICE - the Wood Stove Wont be an Issue with the glass railing



Very low profile and minimal wall clearances - aprox 20,000 BTU's

Product Manual

they have unique room only units, here is another style.

66-4%20GWH%20int%201.jpg

This unit is about 17,000 BTU's
 
tbz said:
ICE - the Wood Stove Wont be an Issue with the glass railing



Very low profile and minimal wall clearances - aprox 20,000 BTU's

Product Manual

they have unique room only units, here is another style.

66-4%20GWH%20int%201.jpg

This unit is about 17,000 BTU's
Click to expand...
The bed is unmade because the coroner seldom tidies up.
 
OK, so the majority are leaning yes, not an issue, the question is would you call it out on a plan review, rough-in or final?
 
Plan review. Give them the opportunity to amend the plans before the project gets too far.
“You should have said something sooner, its too late to do it now”.
“But the approved plans don’t show the outlets, why are you changing your mind now?”
 
It doesn't matter if plan review calls it or if the inspector missed it. The permit applicant is responsible for meeting the code.
One (floor) receptacle strategically placed along the guard required.

PA residential code
R105.4 Validity of Permit
The issuance or granting of a permit shall not be construed to be a permit for, or an approval of, any violation of any of the provisions of this code or of any other ordinance of the jurisdiction. Permits presuming to give authority to violate or cancel the provisions of this code or other ordinances of the jurisdiction shall not be valid. The issuance of a permit based on construction documents and other data shall not prevent the building official from requiring the correction of errors in the construction documents and other data. The building official is authorized to prevent occupancy or use of a structure where in violation of this code or of any other ordinances of this jurisdiction.

E3901.2.1 Spacing
Receptacles shall be installed so that no point measured horizontally along the floor line of any wall space is more than 6 feet (1829 mm), from a receptacle outlet. [210.52(A)(1)]

E3901.2.2 Wall Space
As used in this section, a wall space shall include the following: [210.52(A)(2)]
  1. Any space that is 2 feet (610 mm) or more in width, including space measured around corners, and that is unbroken along the floor line by doorways and similar openings, fireplaces, and fixed cabinets.
  2. The space occupied by fixed panels in exterior walls, excluding sliding panels.
  3. The space created by fixed room dividers such as railings and freestanding bar-type counters.
E3901.2.3 Floor Receptacles
Receptacle outlets in floors shall not be counted as part of the required number of receptacle outlets except where located within 18 inches (457 mm) of the wall. [210.52(A)(3)]
 
rogerpa said:
It doesn't matter if plan review calls it or if the inspector missed it. The permit applicant is responsible for meeting the code.
Click to expand...
I know that, and i have been the recipient of that bad news more than once. Even though its correct, it causes bad feelings.
 
Receptacle is required based on (3). Electrical cords that may be strung along the floor, can take place in nearly any code compliant receptacle location and is not the responsibility of the building department.
 
Teeshot said:
Receptacle is required based on (3). Electrical cords that may be strung along the floor, can take place in nearly any code compliant receptacle location and is not the responsibility of the building department.
Click to expand...
Maybe it is just me, but I am confused about what you are trying to say with that reply. ????
 
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