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2012 IFGC CSST bonding

K

kluth

Member
Joined
Feb 14, 2011
Messages
9
Location
Rochester, MN
2009 IFGC Section 310.1.1 requires bonding for ALL CSST and does not provide exceptions. According to the manufacturer's instllation instructions, there are two CSST products which do not require additional bonding: Counterstrike (Trac-pipe) and Flashshield (Tite-flex).

Has this section been amended in the 2012 code?
 
Code trumps installation instructions (unless there are none). Remember the code is a minimum.
 
* * * *

peach,

I always thought that the installation instructions supeceded the code.....What

code section are you referring to from the IFGC?

Also, from the 2012 IFGC - "[A] 102.8 Referenced codes and standards.

The codes and standards referenced in this code shall be those that are listed

in :Next('./icod_ifgc_2012_8.htm')'>Chapter 8 and such codes and standards shall be considered as part of the

requirements of this code to the prescribed extent of each such reference

and as further regulated in Sections 102.8.1 and 102.8.2.



Exception: Where enforcement of a code provision would violate the

conditions of the listing of the equipment or appliance, the conditions of

the listing and the manufacturer’s installation instructions shall apply."

* * * *
 
Northstar....I do not think it would violate the listing to bond it....just not required by the manufacturer....you also have the whole "most restrictive will govern" angle....My 2 cents...but we r still on 2003....I've got like 10 more years to worry about that!
 
Both products have been approved by ICC in an ES report (sorry, I don't have the number in front of me) not to be bonded as long as the appliance it goes to is electrically grounded. Any hard wired appliancde such as a furnace would meet this. I do not accept it on plug in appliances, because once it's unplugged, it's no longer grounded.
 
This is very interesting. The reason that I asked the question is regarding an interpretation by the Minnesota State Board of Electricity regarding bonding of CSST products. You can read the article here:

http://www.dli.mn.gov/ccld/PDF/review18Spring2011.pdf

Currently, our inspection program is in limbo regarding the bonding of the Counterstrike and Flashshield products while the Building Official reviews the matter. The City of Rochester, Minnesota is proposing aligning our interpretation with the State of Minnesota. Please note the State Building Code is not enforced statewide in Minnesota. Thank you, everyone, for your input.

In regards to the exception to IFGC Section 102.8, the intent is for the highest level of safety to prevail. For example, if the code requires a more stringent clearance (from an appliance to combustible construction, per se) than the manufacturer’s requirements, the code applies since the listing is not voided by the increased clearance.
 
installation instructions are what governs; the code is the minimum. I don't know that any of the CSST manufacturers don't require the bond. If the manufacturer doesn't require it (which I don't believe since they lost a class action law suit several years back), the code DOES require it.

bond it
 
Installation instructions supersede code language

The reason installation instructions supersede code language is the code is written every so many years, not to mention adoption by municipalities may even be longer, and manufactures are constantly coming out with new approved products. So in essence I would always refer to manufactures requirements if there was a conflict or the code is silent.

north star said:
* * * *peach,

I always thought that the installation instructions supeceded the code.....What

code section are you referring to from the IFGC?

Also, from the 2012 IFGC - "[A] 102.8 Referenced codes and standards.

The codes and standards referenced in this code shall be those that are listed

in :Next('./icod_ifgc_2012_8.htm')'>Chapter 8 and such codes and standards shall be considered as part of the

requirements of this code to the prescribed extent of each such reference

and as further regulated in Sections 102.8.1 and 102.8.2.



Exception: Where enforcement of a code provision would violate the

conditions of the listing of the equipment or appliance, the conditions of

the listing and the manufacturer’s installation instructions shall apply."

* * * *
Click to expand...
 
Where is the information cumming from that states that either of these products is exempt from 310.1.1? Both manufacturers installation instructions clearly state that they mus be bonded. Section 4.10 in both IOM documents state "The Counter Strike gas piping system shall be bonded in accordance with these instructions and the NFPA 54, IFGC,UPC,NFPA 70 artical 250.104 (B)

Am I missing something?
 
I'm getting to hate this stuff - people just string it up all higgledy-piggledy and figure its OK. Then when the install is disapproved, put on a big display of ignorance. Bonding ?- if I could count the stupified looks that gets.

Monday rant complete - go about your business.....
 
Good discription MAC!

You guy's might want to see what the NEC sez you can bond with, I was called out on it when an Electrical engineer pointed to the NEC requirement which was lessor requirement than the manufacture required. There's diffently some conflicting bonding requirements on CSST.

Pc1
 
we are not in the 2012 yet, however, i've gotten copies of the maunfactuers instructions. they call for bonding. we grab the main line coming into the house. apparently that is satisgactory. the clamp is a ul 647 (i think) i'll have to look it to be sure.
 
codeworks said:
we are not in the 2012 yet, however, i've gotten copies of the maunfactuers instructions. they call for bonding. we grab the main line coming into the house. apparently that is satisgactory. the clamp is a ul 647 (i think) i'll have to look it to be sure.
Click to expand...
UL 647 is correct and both manufacturers require bonding," but no additional bonding requirement imposed by the manufacturers installation instructions."
 
mtlogcabin said:
2nd page of the 1st link states IFGC Section 310.11 (bonding) is not required. Additional requirements are found in the second link. http://www.icc-es.org/reports/pdf_files/PMG/PMG-1058.pdf http://www.icc-es.org/reports/pdf_files/PMG/PMG-1046.pdf
Click to expand...
And the second link under Installation it states," Installation must be in accordance with the TracPipe Flexible Gas Pipe Design Guide and Installation Instructions.

Now on page 52 of that manual under Section 4.10 Electrical Bonding/Grounding it states The CounterStrike gas piping shall be bonded in accordance with these instructions and The National Fuel Gas Code NFPA54/ANSI Z223 etc.
 
Is the wire used for bonding (6 AWG copper wire or 4 AWG copper-clad aluminum) a stranded or solid wire?
 
Mac said:
Is the wire used for bonding (6 AWG copper wire or 4 AWG copper-clad aluminum) a stranded or solid wire?
Click to expand...
The bonding conductor is based upon NFPA 70 Article 70 and Table 250-66.

NEC = (NFPA 70)
 
Here is my understanding. If the code requires something more than what the installation instructions require then we must follow code. If the installation instructions require more than code then we must follow the installation instructions. The NEC has been silent on bonding CSST yet we still had to do it because the installation instructions required it,

I have not checked recently but Omegaflex, which makes Counterstrike, used to require a bond based on T. 250.66 but the gas code only requires #6. I believe. So unless the product requires T.250.66 then a #6 is all that is required. IMO, I would use T.250.66 and CYA.

Here is a good article on Validation of Installation Methods for CSST Gas Piping to Mitigate Lightning Related Damage

Since the gas code requires bonding and there are no exceptions for Counterstrike, IMO it must also be bonded-- I would do it just to CYA anyway.
 
Ok, I've got 2 cents,

I recently started working in a new jurisdiction. The neighboring jurisdiction was doing the inspections for three months while this position was not filled. They were telling the contractors NOT TO bond the black iron gas pipe. When I asked why, I was informed that several CSST pipes had burst in their jurisdiction and it was caused by bonding the iron pipe that serviced the CSST.

Could it be that the manufacturer is diverting responsiblility of over-ridding the code; and still protecting itself by stating that bonding was not required (as far as they were concerned)?

This was in residential dwellings. Anyone else heard of this?
 
Durant said:
Ok, I've got 2 cents,I recently started working in a new jurisdiction. The neighboring jurisdiction was doing the inspections for three months while this position was not filled. They were telling the contractors NOT TO bond the black iron gas pipe. When I asked why, I was informed that several CSST pipes had burst in their jurisdiction and it was caused by bonding the iron pipe that serviced the CSST.

Could it be that the manufacturer is diverting responsiblility of over-ridding the code; and still protecting itself by stating that bonding was not required (as far as they were concerned)?

This was in residential dwellings. Anyone else heard of this?
Click to expand...
The engineering department for the CSST clearly state that the CSST is to be bonded and the advertisement segment states no further bonding required by the manufacturer. Both statements are true, the bonding is in the code and there is no additional bonding that the MFG s feel will help.

As far as the bonding of the black steel in a hybrid system causing the the CSST to rupture IMHO I do not believe that to be true. Decreasing the impedance to ground is a good thing.
 
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