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A or B

iggentleman

iggentleman

Bronze Member
Joined
Jun 24, 2011
Messages
45
Location
Fairfax, VA
I wanted to get your opinion on the proper use group classification.

Golf course clubhouse

2006IBC, VA construction. Mixed use, non-separated.

Main level is a restaurant, retail and offices (A2, M, B)

Upper level is guest suites (R-1)

Lower level is mechanical, locker rooms, showers, sauna, a spa (4 massage room) and a fitness room.

The fitness room is A3 and the spa is B, but what use would you consider the locker, shower, sauna area to be? A or B?
 
Coug Dad said:
sauna, shower, locker room: over 50 persons A, under 50 persons b
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Are those spaces "for the gathering of persons for purposes such as civic, social or religious functions; recreation, food or drink consumption or awaiting transportation"? I don't think they are.

Just because a space has an occupant load of 50 or more does not make it a Group A occupancy--you have to look at the other requirements for a Group A. If an office building has a large open office area over 5,000 sq. ft., then the occupant load of the open office is at least 50--does that make it a Group A? No.

I would classify them as Group B regardless of occupant load.
 
Sorry...I was just thinking height and area calcs on most restrictive for unseperated uses by calling it an A.....Are you looking at occ load calcs for each space? If that is the case I would use some common sense and not figure a shower at 5 net because it is a standing space.....but you could have a crowded locker room.....
 
* = *



"Golf course clubhouse"
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The "clubhouse" assignment would tend to have a social conotation /environment to me....."A" Occ. Group if over 50 occupants, ...agree

with Coug Dad! ;)

* = *
 
The place is sprinkled because of the R1 so regardless of whether it is an A3 or B if it is near the unmodified heights and area limitations it matters little, just need to watch egress width.
 
north star said:
* = *The "clubhouse" assignment would tend to have a social conotation /

environment to me....."A" Occ. Group if over 50 occupants, ...agree

with Coug Dad! ;)

* = *
Click to expand...
With each occupancy group description it states "...the use of a building or structure, or a portion thereof..." Each part of a building needs to be analyzed for its intended use, and those spaces do not qualify as a Group A. I have no doubt that other portions of the building are Group A, but those in question are not.
 
IMO the gym area would be an A3 not B use unless it meets the exception of 50 or less occ load.
 
>

iggentleman,

Does your "locker, shower, sauna areas" fall in to one of the 3 Exceptions

listed in Section 303 of the IBC [ `06 IBC here ]?

From the `06 IBC, Section 303, Exceptions:

1. A building or tenant space used for assembly purposes with an occupant

load of less than 50 persons shall be classified as a Group B occupancy.

2. A room or space used for assembly purposes with an occupant load of

less than 50 persons and accessory to another occupancy shall be

classified as a Group B occupancy or as part of that occupancy.

3. A room or space used for assembly purposes that is less than 750

square feet (70 m2) in area and is accessory to another occupancy

shall be classified as a Group B occupancy or as part of that

occupancy.

<
 
The main uses of the building, office, restaurant and guest rooms (B, A2 and R1) are all on the upper levels.

On the lower level, the fitness room A3 and the spa is B. The lockers, showers, toilets, dressing rooms and sauna are for people using the spa, the fitness room and the golf course, and not accessory to the uses up stairs.

The areas in question at just large enough to be over 50 people if I use the 50 sf per person for locker rooms for the whole space.

I had designated the locker/shower/sauna/dressing as B use and the county reviewer concurred. The contractor had the inspector in for a pre-final walk, and he wants to treat these areas as assembly, which would require exit devices. Talking to another architect who does similar projects, he has not had these type of spaces designate assembly on other jurisdictions.

So my question is, would the locker/shower/sauna/dressing area, in-and-of-itself, be an assembly area?

If I had just a locker, dressing, toilet structure for the golf course, would that be an assembly use?
 
A glof course would be an A-5 in IMO the bathrooms would be accessory to either that use, or another use if they were built into a structure like golf pro/shop (M) or restaurant (A-2)
 
IBC lists use B as Training and Skill Development

NFPA lists Education / training of other than K-12 as M - B

All the Health clubs gymnasiums training dance studios karate classes in the world

DO NOT rise to the A - Assembly hazard of occupancy - WHY

Familiarity by repetetive attendance

Lack of attendant Panic

Occupants generally under the control of an instructor
 
= = =

iggentleman,

What is the square footage of the spaces in question, ...with an

Occupant Load of "just over 50"?

= = =
 
Architect1281 said:
IBC lists use B as Training and Skill Development NFPA lists Education / training of other than K-12 as M - B

All the Health clubs gymnasiums training dance studios karate classes in the world

DO NOT rise to the A - Assembly hazard of occupancy - WHY

Familiarity by repetetive attendance

Lack of attendant Panic

Occupants generally under the control of an instructor
Click to expand...
Where does M :confused: come in to the picture, and exactly when would you apply gymnasium (page 23-2009 IBC, chapter 3: section 303.1. Assembly Group A-3...) gymnasium without spectator seating if not in a place like golds gym? :D
 
OQ: A or B

Sorry...I would classify it as "B" and make sure egress, access and discharge were all in compliance and head on up to the A2 for a little and then possibly the R-1 for a little and then back on down to the B to get ready for round 2. (In this little fantasy it's co-ed of course) :) Sorry just got back from a funeral (Boss) and need to humor myself...thanks for indulging me ;)
 
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