Baseball Field with only one exit

[BayPointArchitect]

Situation:

The proposed plan includes an outdoor grandstand with a maximum capacity of 750 people. Therefore three (3) exits are required and each exit would need to connect to a public way using a "maintainable" surface. There are a few small buildings typical of public baseball fields.

Local codes: 2006 IBC and 2000 NFPA.

Question:

Can you think of how I could allow only one large/wide exit through the control building (ticket booth and concession stand) with the other two exits being gates equipped with panic bars that lead to the right and left foul-ball areas but are still contained within the 10 acre fenced-in area?

The design concept is that additional exits could not be staffed for security. There would be nobody at second and third exits to ensure that kids are not letting their friends sneak in and out to/from the parking lot.

Any advice is appreciated. Otherwise, I'm leaning towards allowing 2nd and 3rd exits to egress into the large open areas of grass.

Thanks

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AIA, NCARB, ICC, NCOA, CSI

ICC Plans Examiner

 

[cda]

Re: Baseball Field with only one exit

1. would have to see site plan

2. is it going to fly with the ahj

3. did you look at 1008.2.1

4. 1025.3

maybe go to two?? and make the second one wider, once again with out seeing a plan hard to call

Is this just little league, or is it a minor league and up where they pay to get in???

 

[texasbo]

Re: Baseball Field with only one exit

1027.6, 2009 IBC, Access to a public way, exception: safe dispersal area?

I too would need to see the plan.

 

[Coug Dad]

Re: Baseball Field with only one exit

Fields are also commonly used for concerts or other assembly events. Make sure egress is adequate for those instances.

 

[BayPointArchitect]

Re: Baseball Field with only one exit

Thanks for the responses.

1) I should not post the site plan that was created by someone else so I have instead provided a hand-sketch that illustrates the problem:

http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/3/25/ ... tePlan.pdf

2) Do I need to mention that I am the AHJ? I don't know that it matters since I am still uncomfortable with the problem not having a clear answer.

3) Thanks CDA and Texas. I did not notice IBC 1008.2.1. That does solve one of two problems.

The other problem being that the dispersal area does not connect to a public way unless you go back through the main exit. Providing two gates through the fence that encloses the 10 acre site would solve that problem. But I am being asked if there can be only one gate or entry/exit point for control.

 

[texasbo]

Re: Baseball Field with only one exit

Thanks for the responses.1) I should not post the site plan that was created by someone else so I have instead provided a hand-sketch that illustrates the problem:

http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/3/25/ ... tePlan.pdf

2) Do I need to mention that I am the AHJ? I don't know that it matters since I am still uncomfortable with the problem not having a clear answer.

3) Thanks CDA and Texas. I did not notice IBC 1008.2.1. That does solve one of two problems.

The other problem being that the dispersal area does not connect to a public way unless you go back through the main exit. Providing two gates through the fence that encloses the 10 acre site would solve that problem. But I am being asked if there can be only one gate or entry/exit point for control.

The dispersal area is an exception to having access to the public way, so if you met the criteria, you would not be required to have any gates. That's exactly why this exception is in the code. Also, sorry about the code edition; the section I quoted was 2009 IBC; I edited my earlier post.

 

[Plans Approver]

Re: Baseball Field with only one exit

You may also want to look at ICC 300 standard for grandstands. Look at all accessibility requirements of 1108.2 including accessible team or player seating and lawn seating.

I think the answers you received on the forum are good. To get people out of the dispersal areas after or during the incident, I would accept chain locked gates beyond the toilet rooms. All fire departments around here carry bolt cutters to cut sprinkler chains and a variety of other tools to get through other impediments. Or a free standing masonry/concrete pier just outside those gates with a Knox box.

 

[cda]

Re: Baseball Field with only one exit

1. You do not meet half the diagonal distance/ disapproved

sounds like an operational problem for the stadium, and if they are charging, they should be able to pay someone to watch a gate.

 

[Plans Approver]

Re: Baseball Field with only one exit

What? Diagonal of the baseball field? Are you kidding me??? :shock:

If the ticket gate, grandstand, dugouts, and toilet rooms meet the requirements of of the code individually and the exception in IBC 1024.6, including accessibility, is met. The code has been satisfied. The dispersal area does not have to lead to a public way - it IS the public way.

 

[kilitact]

Re: Baseball Field with only one exit

cda wrote:

1. You do not meet half the diagonal distance/ disapprovedsounds like an operational problem for the stadium, and if they are charging, they should be able to pay someone to watch a gate.

I would agree with cda, how can a code official approve this exit layout. :roll:

 

[Plans Approver]

Re: Baseball Field with only one exit

Y'all got me. The gates to the dispersal area are too small. For 750 spectators plus staff, those gates probably need to be 2 - 4' wide gates at each location.

This is outdoors not inside a building. You probably have a section in your code similar to this (my emphasis):

IBC 101.2 Scope. The provisions of this code shall apply to the construction, alteration, movement, enlargement, replacement, repair, equipment, use and occupancy, location, maintenance, removal and demolition of every building or structure or any appurtenances connected or attached to such buildings or structures.IBC 101.3 Intent. The purpose of this code is to establish the minimum requirements to safeguard the public health, safety and general welfare through structural strength, means of egress facilities, stability, sanitation, adequate light and ventilation, energy conservation, and safety to life and property from fire and other hazards attributed to the built environment and to provide safety to fire fighters and emergency responders during emergency operations.

What code sections are to be applied for disapproval? It's not about exits, it's about exit discharge.

 

[BayPointArchitect]

Pair of 4' gates

Without first calculating the exit width, I would have agreed with Plans Approver that there needs to be a pair of 48" wide gates. However, I am thinking that these secondary exits need to accomodate 50% of the 750 people which would be 188 people for gate #2 and 188 people for gate #3. That would require only 38". A single 48" wide gate would allow for 240 people. With two single 48" wide gates, I have only 270 people to take care of at the main exit #1.

As for the idea that the large open area beyond the home run fence becomes a public way... I'm not so sure about that when I read the definition provided in Chapter 10. But I'm thinking that this large dispersal area is in lieu of the connection to a public way. Am I wrong again? Thanks everyone for your responsiveness.

Chapter 10 definition:

PUBLIC WAY. A street, alley or other parcel of land open to the outside air leading to a street, that has been deeded, dedicated or otherwise permanently appropriated to the public for public use and which has a clear width and height of not less than 10 feet.

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AIA, NCARB, ICC, NCOA, CSI

ICC Plans Examiner

 

[texasbo]

Re: Pair of 4' gates

Without first calculating the exit width, I would have agreed with Plans Approver that there needs to be a pair of 48" wide gates. However, I am thinking that these secondary exits need to accomodate 50% of the 750 people which would be 188 people for gate #2 and 188 people for gate #3. That would require only 38". A single 48" wide gate would allow for 240 people. With two single 48" wide gates, I have only 270 people to take care of at the main exit #1.As for the idea that the large open area beyond the home run fence becomes a public way... I'm not so sure about that when I read the definition provided in Chapter 10. But I'm thinking that this large dispersal area is in lieu of the connection to a public way. Am I wrong again? Thanks everyone for your responsiveness.

Chapter 10 definition:

PUBLIC WAY. A street, alley or other parcel of land open to the outside air leading to a street, that has been deeded, dedicated or otherwise permanently appropriated to the public for public use and which has a clear width and height of not less than 10 feet.

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AIA, NCARB, ICC, NCOA, CSI

ICC Plans Examiner

I think what Plans Approver meant was that a dispersal area is allowed instead of a public way.

This is a concept that is clearly allowed by the code, and routinely used in cases such as yours.

 

[SCBO1]

Re: Baseball Field with only one exit

I agree with Plans approver, but wonder why you could'nt require locations 2 & 3 to have double gates and the 10 acre area to have pass out gates as well.

After seven innings, open the sucker up so you can beat the crowd out!

 

[Plans Approver]

Re: Baseball Field with only one exit

I was a bit conservative in the calculation of the occupant load. 750 spectators in grandstand, 100 standing room, 70 "players" (35 each team - players, coaches, trainers, dugout staff), 50 staff including scorekeepers, reporters, camera crews. Total 970 occupants in the 10 acres. Presuming the dugouts are open to the field, the dugouts would not exit back to the grandstand area. The gates were sized per Table 1005.1 at .2 inches per occupant, since there is no guidance on sizing gates (they could just as well be framed doors). 96 inches of gates allows 480 occupants to pass into the area of dispersal or 960 through all gates. Exit discharge is not regulated for 50% or remoteness. The area and distance requirements of 1024.6 must be met. The area of dispersal, path to it and part of it must be accessible IMO.

1024.6 Access to a public way. The exit discharge shall provide a direct and unobstructed access to a public way.Exception: Where access to a public way cannot be provided, a safe dispersal area shall be provided where all of the following are met:1. The area shall be of a size to accommodate at least 5 square feet for each person.2. The area shall be located on the same lot at least 50 feet away from the building requiring egress.3. The area shall be permanently maintained and identified as a safe dispersal area.4. The area shall be provided with a safe and unobstructed path of travel from the building.

There are instances where the path of travel to the public way is not safe or not achievable due to site constraints or security concerns. The provisions in this section specify what would constitute a safe area to allow occupants of a building to assemble in an emergency. The 5 square feet would allow adequate space for standing persons as well as some space for persons in wheelchairs or on stretchers.

The definition to Public Way includes the specifics for a parcel of land permanently appropriated for public use, and, Exception No. 3 requires the area of dispersal to be permanent. If this is a public field then there shouldn't be a problem. If it is private, then the legal paper work needs to filed with the proper authorities and submitted to you before final approval.

I probably shouldn't have wrote that "it is the public way. Better or more accurately stated would have been " it is the de facto public way" or "substitutes for the public way", "acts as the public way" or some better description.

People get antsy and don't want to stay "caged" that is why I suggested additional gates beyond the toilet rooms to the parking areas to be opened by responding personnel or staff.

 

[cda]

Re: Baseball Field with only one exit

1024.6 looks like it would work for you, I think I would still require two of the three exits to be near the front area where people will normally be and also, exit.