Bonus trusses & Habitable Attics ???

[righter101]

I did a search of the forum to see if this had been discussed yet.

How are you all treating bonus trusses that create a space that may be unfinished, but by definition is a "habitable attic", with regards to EERO?

Seems like it is required, technically, but by virtue of design, not easy to provide.

Thoughts.

Thanks.

 

[cda]

HABITABLE SPACE. A space in a building for living, sleeping, eating or cooking. Bathrooms, toilet rooms, closets, halls, storage or utility spaces and similar areas are not considered habitable spaces.

how is the are identified on the plans?

 

[ICE]

ATTIC, HABITABLE. A finished or unfinished area, not considered a story, complying with all of the following requirements:1. The occupiable floor area is at least 70 square feet (17 m2), in accordance with Section R304,2. The occupiable floor area has a ceiling height in accordance with Section R305, and3. The occupiable space is enclosed by the roof assembly above, knee walls (if applicable) on the sides and the floor-ceiling assembly below.EERO is required for sleeping rooms....so no sleeping in a habitable attic without a EERO.Here is one I found at an open house last weekend.

View attachment 866

View attachment 867

View attachment 866

View attachment 867

/monthly_2013_09/DSCN1826_zps7e51e0d1.jpg.e3f37d0412d5d06872c2febe04bbd6d3.jpg

/monthly_2013_09/DSCN1827_zps6a3594ab.jpg.684f1f5b2c52270dfa85c331cfad6066.jpg

 

[mark handler]

I did a search of the forum to see if this had been discussed yet.How are you all treating bonus trusses that create a space that may be unfinished, but by definition is a "habitable attic", with regards to EERO? Seems like it is required, technically, but by virtue of design, not easy to provide. Thoughts. Thanks.

Are the trusses designed for "habitable" space or light storage on the lower cord?

 

[Paul Sweet]

I'm probably opening the floodgates here, but how do you know the space will be used as a bedroom?

 

[tmurray]

Are we talking about gable ends? I've seen french doors in the gable end of bonus room trusses.

Operable skylight?

 

[Darren Emery]

This portion of the code is to me, poorly written.

If you have a habitable attic, finished or not, regardless of whether someone sleeps in it or not, you must install an EERO.

The definition of a habitable attic says nothing about a stairway to said space. If I have no stairway, how do I get to this habitable space? If I have a stairway, why is this not a story?

It seems to me as if two independant parties wrote these sections of the code, and never compared notes. At 890 pages, bound to happen.

Anyone up for adopting the Code of Hammurabi?

 

[Darren Emery]

Paul - doesn't matter what they intend to use the space for:

SECTION R310

EMERGENCY ESCAPE AND RESCUE OPENINGS

R310.1 Emergency escape and rescue required. Basements,

habitable attics and every sleeping room shall have at

least one operable emergency escape and rescue opening.

 

[McShan]

If the attic has permanent stairs and meets all the other requirements such as ceiling height and square footage, I require egress windows, if pull down I do not, this seems to be a reasonable approach to me, and meet the intent of the code. Just my opinion.

 

[fatboy]

Ditto..........

Local amendment, if there are stairs, habitable attic, we require NEC requirements be roughed in..........we will in all likelihood never see a permit or inspections for the subsequent finish.

 

[McShan]

its hard enough to get them to permit the new houses much less a finish out of an attic.

 

[fatboy]

Thus, our amendment. If they want to keep legal, then............do it right, or don't do it at all............

 

[ICE]

Paul - doesn't matter what they intend to use the space for:SECTION R310

EMERGENCY ESCAPE AND RESCUE OPENINGS

R310.1 Emergency escape and rescue required. Basements,

habitable attics and every sleeping room shall have at

least one operable emergency escape and rescue opening.

Thankfully, I have encountered only one such habitable attic since we adopted the IRC. That one did have a window. I can't remember if that window would qualify as an EERO but I kinda doubt it. The space contains a furnace, water heater and storage so I'm not all that worried about an EERO. The access is a pull down stair that when lowered, blocks the master bedroom door.

This forum works for me. Thanks to Darren, that's one code I'll never miss again.

The definition of a habitable attic leaves no escape from an EERO if the conditions are met. Apparently, a designer as in the case I mentioned, can identify a space as storage/equipment room but still be required to provide an EERO. If we are locked in that the space is habitable, even with bare framing, are we required to treat the space as habitable in every respect such as light and ventilation, heat, etc.? Will the tax man count it as floor space? Would I have to sweep the floor each Saturday just like the rest of the house?

 

[GBrackins]

I guess I'm confused .....

If it is called storage (attic space) and does not have a EERO then it would fail to meet the definition of a habitable space? if it's not a habitable space how can it be a habitable attic?

Definition: HABITABLE SPACE. A space in a building for living, sleeping, eating or cooking. Bathrooms, toilet rooms, closets, halls, storage or utility spaces and similar areas are not considered habitable spaces.

I understand those with local amendments ....

 

[ICE]

It doesn't take much to be a habitable attic. It has nothing to do with a designer's description, choice or intent. If the glove fits, you must acquit.

ATTIC, HABITABLE. A finished or unfinished area, not considered a story, complying with all of the following requirements:1. The occupiable floor area is at least 70 square feet (17 m2), in accordance with Section R304,

2. The occupiable floor area has a ceiling height in accordance with Section R305, and

3. The occupiable space is enclosed by the roof assembly above, knee walls (if applicable) on the sides and the floor-ceiling assembly below.

If 1,2 and 3 are present, a habitable attic exists. There is no decision to be made. It is there and there is nothing that can be done about it.

This section requires an EERO. It should be #4 with the code section above.

SECTION R310EMERGENCY ESCAPE AND RESCUE OPENINGS

R310.1 Emergency escape and rescue required. Basements, habitable attics and every sleeping room shall have at least one operable emergency escape and rescue opening.

Had section 310 not required a EERO for, the argument could be made to allow a designer to designate what the space is because it would not matter.

This section doesn't matter given that the entire issue is decided.

HABITABLE SPACE. A space in a building for living, sleeping, eating or cooking. Bathrooms, toilet rooms, closets, halls, storage or utility spaces and similar areas are not considered habitable spaces.

 

[GBrackins]

so then ANY attic that contains:

1. at least 70 s.f. of floor area

2. has a ceiling height in accordance with R305

3. and is enclosed by the roof assembly above

then it is an habitable attic?

 

[fatboy]

I believe that the term "occupied", would be the key. Again, in our jurisdiction, if there is compliant access to the attic space, it is "occupiable".

 

[ICE]

so then ANY attic that contains:1. at least 70 s.f. of floor area

2. has a ceiling height in accordance with R305

3. and is enclosed by the roof assembly above

then it is an habitable attic?

Yes....until somebody comes up with code to debunk the premise.

 

[ICE]

I believe that the term "occupied", would be the key. Again, in our jurisdiction, if there is compliant access to the attic space, it is "occupiable".

Not that I would disagree, but what qualifies as compliant access? Is there a way to justify that with code?

 

[fatboy]

Compliant stairs, doors, handrails, guards..........and the three conditions listed above.

 

[ICE]

Compliant stairs, doors, handrails, guards..........and the three conditions listed above.

I don't see that in the code. There is no mention of access to the attic at the definition. If 1, 2 and 3 are met, there is a habitable attic. Granted, it sounds dumb to say that a portion of a building could be habitable and yet, you need a ladder to get there. But so far, we are left with exactly that.

This is the required access to an attic. There is no mention of a habitable attic with another requirement for access.

R807.1 Attic access. Buildings with combustible ceiling or roof construction shall have an attic access opening to attic areas that exceed 30 square feet and have a vertical

height of 30 inches or greater. The vertical height shall be measured from the top of the ceiling framing members to the underside of the roof framing members. The rough-framed opening shall not be less than 22 inches by 30 inches and shall be located in a hallway or other readily accessible location. When located in a wall, the opening shall be a minimum of 22 inches wide by 30 inches high. When the access is located in a ceiling, minimum unobstructed headroom in the attic space shall be 30 inches at some point above the access measured vertically from the bottom of ceiling framing members. See the California Mechanical Code for access requirements where mechanical equipment is located in attics.

 

[fatboy]

Actually cold one, I will concede the point.

I argued in another thread previously, that you could access an habitable attic, via ladder, and egress via a slide. Thanks for reminding me.

 

[Glennman CBO]

Washington State has an amendment adding to the definition "conditioned space". If it is not conditioned, no EERO needed.

The part that baffles me where it states "enclosed by a roof" (or something to that effect). Many of the bonus rooms we see have roof on the sides, but gables on the ends. Does this constitute being enclosed by a roof? In those cases, we require an EERO.