Civil Rights

[conarb]

As I've said before nothing has turned out so bad for this country is this discriminatory Civil Rights law, I've also said that education is ground zero in the fight to overturn this discrimination, give special priviliges to one class and you take them away from another, witness the costs to businesses and taxpayers of the disability laws, to say nothing of all the parking spaces reserved for the disabled that the able-bodied can't use.

A complaint Friday alleged that Harvard University discriminates against Asian-American applicants by setting a higher bar for admissions than that faced by other groups.The complaint, filed by a coalition of 64 organizations, says the university has set quotas to keep the numbers of Asian-American students significantly lower than the quality of their applications merits. It cites third-party academic research on the SAT exam showing that Asian-Americans have to score on average about 140 points higher than white students, 270 points higher than Hispanic students and 450 points higher than African-American students to equal their chances of gaining admission to Harvard. The exam is scored on a 2400-point scale.

“Many studies have indicated that Harvard University has been engaged in systemic and continuous discrimination against Asian-Americans during its very subjective ‘Holistic’ college admissions process,” the complaint alleges.

The coalition is seeking a federal investigation and is requesting Harvard “immediately cease and desist from using stereotypes, racial biases and other discriminatory means in evaluating Asian-American applicants.”¹

BTW, Stanford has the exact same formula, 140 advantage over whites, 270 over Hispanics, 450 over blacks, and 600 over American Indians, nothing is said in the lawsuit but I'm sure Harvard gives the same advantages to American Indians as Stanford does because of Senator Hiawatha from Massachusetts, these numbers are based upon the average IQs of the racial groups.

¹ http://www.wsj.com/articles/asian-american-organizations-seek-federal-probe-of-harvard-admission-policies-1431719348

 

[ADAguy]

Conarb, in a free an open society such as ours, a persons freewill allows you to speak out as you do while allowing others to make use/or not of the opportunities available.

Consider Civil Rights as similar to the printing press and the internet, without them you would not be able to spread your pesstimism in an attempt to downploay others.

You are not alone in your attempts. A recent election in Los Angeles in a council district of 1 mil, only 20k chose to vote out of 450k registered for a new councilman. What of the rest in the district? Each vote would have been critical to the final result.

We hear you on this site but what if you voiced your comments to the decision makers, would they listen?

Heard Bill Clinton last week in Atlanta, now that he is out of office he can make and impliment concepts that would not have been seen as politically correct. helps to be a "former" pres. with lots of money. He is trying which can't be said for many former presidents.

Note: for a native Californian Atlanta was a real eye opener, as was the new Civil Rights museum.

 

[jdfruit]

I love free speech and people that liberally use it. "So now we know"

 

[conarb]

Any time you give superior rights to one group you take away rights from another, civil rights should be equal for all, there should be equal opportunity for all, the way it is we are taking from Asians, Jews, and whites and giving to blacks, Hispanics, and native Americans. Redress for past grievances was reasonable, but it has gotten far out of hand destroying those it was designed to help, Clarance Thomas has said that he's ashamed of his Yale law degree and has put it in a drawer out of sight, Susan Rice has said her biggest fear is that all of her accomplishments will be denigrated by affirmative action. In the case of disability those I know who are confined to wheelchairs and walkers (and that's a lot at my age) want nothing to do with it because of what one described as "the backlash", nobody ever discriminated against handicapped people until activist groups started using them to exploit them.

In a local case our County paid $2.1 million dollars to a Disability Rights Law firm over incarceration of youths in the juvenile hall claiming they were disabled, now I see another disability rights activist group is back suing and will line their pockets at public expense.

BERKELEY -- Contra Costa County Juvenile Hall locks youths with disabilities in solitary confinement for up to 23 hours a day -- in some cases for months -- and denies them schooling, advocacy groups claimed in a federal lawsuit filed Thursday.

The lawsuit by Public Counsel, Berkeley-based Disability Rights Advocates and a private law firm was filed on behalf of the teenage girl and two boys, who are listed as G.F., Q.G and W.B. The latter is a 17-year-old who, according to the lawsuit, began hearing voices after spending 90 days in an isolation cell. All three are in custody.

Contra Costa's juvenile system isn't the first to face a lawsuit. The same advocacy groups brought a lawsuit in 2010 against the Los Angeles Juvenile Hall, one of the largest systems in the nation, but Faer said the problems at the smaller Martinez facility are greater.¹

All of a sudden everyone in jail has become "disabled" and there are lots of slimy disability law firms to profit from it, what a gold mine, there is probably something mentally wrong with most people in jail, now all prisoners can be categorized as disabled and the taxpayers will pay, when you take money from some to pay for others you take the freedom to do with his money away from some to benefit others.

It's time to do away with Johnson's Civil Rights act and his War on Poverty has been a disaster, the problem with this entire subject that eventually some social Justice Warrior will play the race card, I certainly give the Asian groups credit for challenging this at ground zero, our educational system.

¹ http://www.contracostatimes.com/news/ci_23824485/lawsuit-contra-costa-juvenile-hall-locks-youth-disabilities

 

[conarb]

In other news a disabled man has been charged with drunk driving in his scooter, I guess the disability activists will start representing drunks since alcoholism has been declared a disease.

TRAVERSE CITY – The Michigan appeals court has reinstated charges against a man who admits he was drunk while riding a four-wheeled electric scooter that can go only 4 m.p.h.The issue for the court was whether the scooter qualifies as a vehicle under state law. In a 3-0 decision Wednesday, the court says William Lyon can be prosecuted because he took the scooter onto a public road.

The court says Lyon, who is disabled, must follow the "rules of the road."

He admits he was drunk and had an open can of beer when police stopped him on a Traverse City road.

Lyon was charged with a third offense of driving drunk.¹

Pretty soon everyone will have those disabilty placards, get stopped for driving drunk, get a free defense from a disabiity law firm.

¹ http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2015/05/20/drunken-driver-scooter-appeal/27642961/

 

[mtlogcabin]

In2003,theU.S.SupremeCourtclarifiedsomeoftheconfusionexperiencedbythelowerfederalcourtswithrespecttoaffirmativeactionprogramsinhighereducation.InGrutter v. Bollinger, 539 U.S.___, 123 S. Ct. 2325, ___ L. Ed. 2d___ (2003), the Court upheld a practice by the law school at the University of Michigan that considered race one of the factors the school considered when admitting students. The ruling upheld the decision in board of regents of theuniversity of california v. bakke, 438 U.S. 265, 98 S. Ct. 2733, 57 L. Ed. 2d 750 (1978), a controversial decision that had likewise allowed schools to consider race as a factor in admissions. In a companion case to Grutter, however theCourt limited the scope of affirmative action programs of universities when it struck down Michigan's undergraduate admissions policies. Gratz v. Bollinger, 539 U.S. ___, 123 S. Ct. 2411, ___ L. Ed. 2d ___ (2003). Unlike the law school'sadmissions policies at Michigan, the undergraduate admissions department added a certain number of "points" to the application of a racial minority. Because the university added these points automatically without consideration of theindividual applicant, the Court held that this policy could not pass constitutional muster.

So as long as you require a certain group to score higher than another it must be legal? :banghd

 

[JBI]

Automatically adding points with out considering the individual applicant is NOT constitutional according to the last decision. I would guess that a black candidate with a 4.0 from a prestigious prep school and a trust fund should not get the extra points?

 

[ADAguy]

Mt? So you would allow for deletion of military credits too?

 

[mtlogcabin]

Mt? So you would allow for deletion of military credits too?

Why not. Military service, ethnic, racial, religious or chosen lifestyles, are not factors that determine if you are college material or not. Look at the drop out rates of those given extra credits to get into a college, they are pretty high. Would you apply the same system for commercial airline pilots, or surgeons, that you may use. Granting admissions to a college based on a "credit point system" only guarantees the college of students with students loans that where only approved because they where minority. It is nothing more than a way to transfer federal money to the colleges through the student government back loan program. College tuition has been going up at double digit rate increases and they are very top heavy in administrative staff costs(salaries) A college education does not mean much in today's world since most liberal arts degrees are worthless when it comes to getting a job in the real world.

Applying to a college is not like applying for a job. If you are not college material then head to junior college and start you training/education there. Colleges do not train you like a job/employer may do. They expect you to already have the skills and ability to do the work and to be completed on time and correctly. If not you fail, if you fail enough times you are tossed out.

A study done in 2002 confirmed that high school graduates of the 1950s did approximately the same on a general information test as college seniors did today. (Zogby Poll International conducted for the Princeton, NY-based National Association of Scholars).

 

[conarb]

All civil rights issues stem from the famous Koramatsu case where the Roosevelt administration incarcerated American citizens based upon their race, it created "suspect classes", there are suspect classes entitled to strict scrutiny, quasi-suspect classes entitled to somewhat lower levels of scrutiny, and other groups like the old and the disabled that are only entitled to rational basis scrutiny.

• The group has historically been discriminated against, and/or have been subject to prejudice, hostility, and/or stigma, perhaps due, at least in part, to stereotypes.
  
• They possess an immutable and/or highly visible trait.
  
• They are powerless to protect themselves via the political process. (The group is a "discrete" and "insular" minority.)
  
• The group's distinguishing characteristic does not inhibit it from contributing meaningfully to society.
  
  

All others

Rational basis scrutiny is applied to all other discriminatory statutes. Rational basis scrutiny currently covers all other discriminatory criteria—e.g., age, disability, wealth, political preference, political affiliation, or felons.

Rational basis

When rational basis review is used, it means that the classification is one that overwhelmingly tends to be rational, e.g. distinguishing criminals from non-criminals. This leads to wide political discretion and a focus of judicial resources to other cases where the classification employed tends to be more suspicious, and thus close judicial balancing is needed.¹

Discriminating against a racial group like the Japanese deserves a much higher level of scrutiny than discriminating against an old person, a wheelchair-bound person, a rich person, or a poor person, they are approached on a rational basis. So requiring a business to repaint faded disabled signs must be looked at rationally, the height of toilets must be looked at rationally, on the other hand discriminating against a Japanese person in favor off a black person deserves a high degree of scrutiny. The highest scoring groups on SAT tests are Ashkenazi Jews (not Hebrew or Shephardic Jews), certain Asian groups follow with aboriginal peoples at the bottom, Australian Aborigines, sub-Saharan Africans, and Native Americans. As a result of this SAT tests have been drastically downgraded, under the old difficult tests the last person to get a perfect score was, unbelievably, Steve Ballmer, now both Stanford and Harvard have more perfect SAT applicants than they have admission slots. GPAs in secondary schools have also been drastically inflated, they no longer grade on the curve with strict percentages of As and Fs, failing no-one and giving way more As to the point that it is all meaningless. Professor Harvey Mansfield has exposed the fact that Harvard awards nothing but As, A-, A, and A+, when quotas were first devised (declared unconstitutional by Bakke) the majority of the unqualified minorities fell into the bottom 1/3 and promptly flunked out, professors were ordered not to flunk out members of suspect classes so they were placed in the dilemma of flunking out more qualified people sitting right next to less-qualified members of suspect classes. Finally the curve grading system was abolished and they have ended up graduating everyone with an A average, qualified or not.

In the Grutter case Mt. Man mentioned above Justice O'Connor 'mentioned' for the first time the word "Diversity", we have gone wild since trying to dreate a 'diverse' society, qualified or not, I heard a program on the radio yesterday with some saying we have 82 IQs sitting in control towers guiding airplanes.

Napolitano said the new “biographical questionnaire” instituted for the first time in February when the FAA set out to hire 1,300 flight controllers is denying qualified applicants with degrees in aviation science and in some cases, pilot licenses, a chance at a job.About 92 percent of the 28,000 applicants failed the new screening tool, causing schools from California to Washington to complain that the cream of the crop are being left behind.

“Sometimes bureaucracies get in the way. It is consequences that they don’t realize,” Napolitano said during an exclusive interview Thursday at the college.

Napolitano dodged the question other Air Traffic Collegiate Training Initiative schools raised, namely that the FAA and President Barack Obama’s Secretary of Transportation Anthony Foxx are trying to increase diversity among air traffic controllers by adjusting the hiring rules.

She said that depends on what one means by diversity, adding that federal agencies are under Congressional order to fill Affirmative Action quotas of minorities, namely African Americans, Native Americans, Hispanics and Asians.

“We are trying to find out the minority participation,” she said.

Napolitano, on a fact-finding mission, intimated that the FAA may not be accomplishing that goal with the new 62-question test but in fact, doing the opposite.²

A retarded person is protected under the ADA and is considered a disabled person, does that group's distinguishing characteristic inhibit it from contributing meaningfully to society?

¹ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suspect_classification

² http://www.sgvtribune.com/general-news/20140417/air-traffic-students-at-mt-sac-in-walnut-tell-congresswoman-faa-diversity-rules-are-unfair

 

[conarb]

A study done in 2002 confirmed that high school graduates of the 1950s did approximately the same on a general information test as college seniors did today. (Zogby Poll International conducted for the Princeton, NY-based National Association of Scholars).

Intelligence has been dropping drastically in the Western World, particularly in the United States, in past civilizations the Chinese, Persian, Mongol, and other empires were far ahead of Europeans, as their societies developed into entitlement societies they faded, Europeans were a pretty dumb people, then came the plague that wiped out half of Europe, for reasons that have been studied for years it wiped out poor people at a much higher rate than wealthier people and intelligence soared, the Enlightenment occurred, Europeans started exploring and conquering new worlds. The most believable theory, in my estimation, was that the hygiene of the wealthier more intelligent was better allowing them to survive.

Bill Gates famously scored 1590 on the SAT, at a time when many fewer people scored 1600 than people did in subsequent years. He also solved a notable problem in combinatorics as a a college sophomore.

Jeff Bezos graduated summa cum laude from Princeton in computer science

Zuckerberg took a graduate course in computer science as a high school student.

Drew Houston (Dropbox founder) started programming at age 5 and scored 1600 on the SAT.

Steve Jobs tested at the 10th grade level in 4th grade.

This is broadly consistent with "top tech entrepreneurs" having IQ ~145+ (99.8th percentile).

Gates made ~ $100 billion, Jobs would have been ~$100 billion with 20% equity in Apple. Ellison ~$48 B Page $32.3 B, Bezos $32 Brin $32 B, Zuckerberg $28 B, for about $400 billion total. At present, US tech billionaires are worth $355 billion.¹

¹ http://lesswrong.com/lw/jw5/how_much_wealth_is_produced_by_high_iq_people/

 

[mjesse]

...now both Stanford and Harvard have more perfect SAT applicants than they have admission slots...

I currently have two kids in college, and can tell you admissions staff gave us very similar information when discussing our applications.

After acceptance, academic scholarships are being perverted as well. Those dollars all go to the impoverished (e.g, minority students of divorced parents) and athletes.

Sorry to derail the thread, but the college process hits close to home for me.

 

[conarb]

I currently have two kids in college, and can tell you admissions staff gave us very similar information when discussing our applications.After acceptance, academic scholarships are being perverted as well. Those dollars all go to the impoverished (e.g, minority students of divorced parents) and athletes.

Sorry to derail the thread, but the college process hits close to home for me.

You are not derailing this thread, education is ground zero in a massive redistribution of wealth, our money is going to the least competent and the really competent are being ignored, when I first got a computer I took a night class in Photoshop from the high school I dropped out of to go to work to earn the money to go to college when a college degree meant something, in those days the least competent had flunked out and gone to work, in that class one evening the teacher was sitting with one old woman (old, but not as old as I) who just was too dumb to get it, I waited to be the last out and asked her why she just didn't flunk her our so she could teach the rest of the class? She said she was required to bring the entire class along at the same rate! The was before George Bush's "No Child Left Behind", now they are going to have Common Core so kids won't even have to "rote memorize", in my day everyone in college prep classes had to memorize Shakespeare and recite 20 minutes without error, or be thrown out of college prep and learn a trade or get some kind of menial job. In many classes in college and all of law school classes were taught by the Socratic method, students called to stand and explain what they were assigned the day before, in law school you had to recite by IRAC, issues, reasoning, analysis, and conclusion, professors would berate poor reasoning,

does an interesting and accurate job of illustrating this, we are squandering our wealth by diverting it to our most incompetent people. Schools have become nothing but dumbing down indoctrination centers to babysit children. I sure hope those Asian groups win and get a broad decision applicable to all civil rights, maybe we can even get our First Amendment Freedom of Association back, and say "Sorry Jane Wheelchair, I do not choose to serve you." My mechanic still has a sign up in his office that says: "We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone.", I told him that was no-longer legal, he didn't believe that the government could take that basic right away from anyone. To bring it home here when we talk about disability how many CBOs even know the difference between the strict interpretation of the law and the rational approach applicable to accessibility?

 

[mjesse]

...She said she was required to bring the entire class along at the same rate! The was before George Bush's "No Child Left Behind"..

You going to get me rolling again

I have a HUGE problem with the above, as my kids were in school while the NCLB Act was in effect. It may as well have been called the "Everyone Must Be The Same" Act. Guess what? Not all people can grow up to be quantum physicists, and the world still needs laborers and tradespeople.

Some kids are going to get D's and F's and that's OK! NCLB led to teaching to the lowest common denominator. Fortunately, my kid's schools had great "advanced placement" programs where they could actually learn and not be bored to death spending eight weeks on the same topic while little Jimmy and Johnny were coached along in order to pass a test.

Sorry to say, but the low scoring students SHOULD be left behind. Sorry Johnny, you're gonna work in the coal mine just like your pappy. If Johnny won't do it, we'll be forced to get Juan to do it. He'll do it for less money anyway. (that's not racist, it's a metaphor)

The way to make America great is not to standardize mediocrity, but to reward the best in class. We'll never end poverty, just like we'll never end stupid. Everyone is NOT entitled to equal treatment, some DESERVE better. ( I think that's the rational approach, no?)

 

[jdfruit]

There is a massive difference between intelligence and so called "learning". A very good example is Henry Ford; very intelligent, inventive, and innovative. There was a lawsuit by his shareholders that accused him of not being smart enough to run the company and that put their investment at risk so they wanted him removed. During the trial, plaintiff attorney asked Henry a general knowledge question, his answer was something like Why bother with remembering unimportant facts when I can buy an encyclopedia and look that up when I need the information.

So out of all this "who gets into college?" debate, what is important enough to make the decision?

 

[mjesse]

So out of all this "who gets into college?" debate, what is important enough to make the decision?

We already have standardized testing, ACT/SAT etc., understandably, they're not perfect. The OP started by saying those test scores are being "fudged" to bring more or less "diversity" to the schools.

Having an admission process which counts the scores, GPA, extracurricular activities, and the infamous essay is a good way to make the decisions. Fudging any of those based on a "civil rights" bias is cause for concern.

 

[ADAguy]

Helps to explain why I was required to draft regulations implemeting a state law using no more than 8th grade words and yet most of the legislature is made up of attorneys.

Also why passing scores on professionals exams only require achieving a minimum score.

Note: Loyola Marymount awards scholasrships based on academic merit no matter the parents income. They also award scholarships to underprivledged students too amd many graduate with honors.

 

[conarb]

The whole concept of diversity should be scrapped, it was Justice O'Connor's way of making an end run around the unconstitutionalities of Quota's and Affirmative Action. Notice in this cartoon that the girl looking into colleges values a "perfectly diverse group of happy laughing friends". I doubt that she got those values from her family, it shows the indoctrination of the school system. When I went to college I could have cared less for diversity, I wanted to go and associate with the some of the smartest and wealthiest kids in the world.

View attachment 1186

View attachment 1186

/monthly_2013_11/luann.gif.1da4542348e9902ac16325c4a603f4da.gif

 

[MASSDRIVER]

Mt? So you would allow for deletion of military credits too?

No.

Can you guess why?

If not I will tell you; Because they wrote the check, blank with a signature, for their lives. From the SEAL or SOF working a high op tempo at the tip of the spear, to the mechanic that got deployed in a shlt hole for a year. They had 1*, and did it. That ALONE should give them privileged status, and a leg up on your standard unmotivated skell "studying" socio-economics.

I really can't believe the difference is so subtle that it can't be detected.

This birthright crap needs to end, and with a quickness. I apply that to immigration too. I'll trade any motivated Latino for one of our white trash entitlement monkeys any day.

As a matter of fact, that should be our national policy. One guy jumps the fence ready to work, and we kick three worthless turds hard in the a55 in a southbound direction.

I'm going to start drinking early tonight.

Brent.