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condensate drain line to floor drain
- Thread starter SCBO1
- Start date
skipharper
REGISTERED
Re: condensate drain line to floor drain
307.2.2 Drain pipe materials and sizes.
Components of the condensate disposal system shall be cast iron, galvanized steel, copper, cross-linked polyethylene, polybutylene, polyethylene, ABS, CPVC or PVC pipe or tubing. All components shall be selected for the pressure and temperature rating of the installation. Condensate waste and drain line size shall be not less than ¾-inch (19 mm) internal diameter and shall not decrease in size from the drain pan connection to the place of condensate disposal. Where the drain pipes from more than one unit are manifolded together for condensate drainage, the pipe or tubing shall be sized in accordance with an approved method. All horizontal sections of drain piping shall be installed in uniform alignment at a uniform slope.
Now go to IPC SECTION 308 PIPING SUPPORT
307.2.2 Drain pipe materials and sizes.
Components of the condensate disposal system shall be cast iron, galvanized steel, copper, cross-linked polyethylene, polybutylene, polyethylene, ABS, CPVC or PVC pipe or tubing. All components shall be selected for the pressure and temperature rating of the installation. Condensate waste and drain line size shall be not less than ¾-inch (19 mm) internal diameter and shall not decrease in size from the drain pan connection to the place of condensate disposal. Where the drain pipes from more than one unit are manifolded together for condensate drainage, the pipe or tubing shall be sized in accordance with an approved method. All horizontal sections of drain piping shall be installed in uniform alignment at a uniform slope.
Now go to IPC SECTION 308 PIPING SUPPORT
north star
MODERATOR
- Joined
- Oct 19, 2009
- Messages
- 4,596
Re: condensate drain line to floor drain
Pcinspector1,
Section 307 [ in the `06 IMC ] addresses the condensate disposal location:
307.1 Fuel-burning appliances.
Liquid combustion by-products of condensing appliances shall be collected and
discharged to an approved plumbing fixture or disposal area in accordance with
the manufacturer’s installation instructions.
Condensate piping shall be of approved corrosion-resistant material and shall
not be smaller than the drain connection on the appliance. Such piping shall
maintain a minimum horizontal slope in the direction of discharge of not less than
one-eighth unit vertical in 12 units horizontal (1-percent slope).
Section 802.2 [ in the `06 IPC ] addresses directly the requirement of indirect
wastes. Section 802.2 - Installation.
Section 802.2 - Installation.
All indirect waste piping shall discharge through an air gap or air break into a
waste receptor or standpipe. Waste receptors and standpipes shall be trapped
and vented and shall connect to the building drainage system.
All indirect waste piping that exceeds 2 feet (610 mm) in developed length
measured horizontally, or 4 feet (1219 mm) in total developed length, shall be
trapped.
No, the contractors do not need to be ' zip tying ' any piping to the floor drains.
Section 802.2 requires an air gap over the floor drain, or cut a hole in the floor
drain and place the piping into it, if the floor drain is large enough to
accommodate the cutting of the floor drain grate and insertion of the piping in
to it.
<
Pcinspector1,
Section 307 [ in the `06 IMC ] addresses the condensate disposal location:
307.1 Fuel-burning appliances.
Liquid combustion by-products of condensing appliances shall be collected and
discharged to an approved plumbing fixture or disposal area in accordance with
the manufacturer’s installation instructions.
Condensate piping shall be of approved corrosion-resistant material and shall
not be smaller than the drain connection on the appliance. Such piping shall
maintain a minimum horizontal slope in the direction of discharge of not less than
one-eighth unit vertical in 12 units horizontal (1-percent slope).
Section 802.2 [ in the `06 IPC ] addresses directly the requirement of indirect
wastes. Section 802.2 - Installation.
Section 802.2 - Installation.
All indirect waste piping shall discharge through an air gap or air break into a
waste receptor or standpipe. Waste receptors and standpipes shall be trapped
and vented and shall connect to the building drainage system.
All indirect waste piping that exceeds 2 feet (610 mm) in developed length
measured horizontally, or 4 feet (1219 mm) in total developed length, shall be
trapped.
No, the contractors do not need to be ' zip tying ' any piping to the floor drains.
Section 802.2 requires an air gap over the floor drain, or cut a hole in the floor
drain and place the piping into it, if the floor drain is large enough to
accommodate the cutting of the floor drain grate and insertion of the piping in
to it.
<
Re: condensate drain line to floor drain
I agree with Mule, the air gap starts at the flood level of the rim, not down inside the drain. I do see them cut the grate so the water doesn't splash everywhere but there has to be a gap between the pipe and drain. If the piping wasn't secured in place it wouldn't stay over the hole they cut in the drain grate.
I agree with Mule, the air gap starts at the flood level of the rim, not down inside the drain. I do see them cut the grate so the water doesn't splash everywhere but there has to be a gap between the pipe and drain. If the piping wasn't secured in place it wouldn't stay over the hole they cut in the drain grate.
north star
MODERATOR
- Joined
- Oct 19, 2009
- Messages
- 4,596
Re: condensate drain line to floor drain
I agree that the correct way to install the condensate line would be to securely fasten
it and support it [ over it's entire length ] to the floor drain or other approved location.
Most contractors do not do this!
IMO, I think that inserting the drain line in to the floor drain ' WOULD ' provide the
required air gap AND be directed in to the approved location [ without spilling out on
to the adjacent surfaces ]. The requirement of being securely fastened in place &
supported throughout the entire run; with the correct slope, also needs to be
addressed. All of these issues would need to be addressed so that a compliant
installation is achieved.
>
I agree that the correct way to install the condensate line would be to securely fasten
it and support it [ over it's entire length ] to the floor drain or other approved location.
Most contractors do not do this!
IMO, I think that inserting the drain line in to the floor drain ' WOULD ' provide the
required air gap AND be directed in to the approved location [ without spilling out on
to the adjacent surfaces ]. The requirement of being securely fastened in place &
supported throughout the entire run; with the correct slope, also needs to be
addressed. All of these issues would need to be addressed so that a compliant
installation is achieved.
>
Re: condensate drain line to floor drain
How would there be an air gap when the pipe is inserted into the floor drain? Any type of sewer back up could potentially cause a cross connection if the pipe is below the flood level of the drain.
How would there be an air gap when the pipe is inserted into the floor drain? Any type of sewer back up could potentially cause a cross connection if the pipe is below the flood level of the drain.
Coug Dad
Platinum Member
Re: condensate drain line to floor drain
Do we care about the gap between the floor drain and the condensate drain? Where is the potable water that could be contaminated?
Do we care about the gap between the floor drain and the condensate drain? Where is the potable water that could be contaminated?
Re: condensate drain line to floor drain
It is typical in this area to see the condensate piping along the floor near the furnace and fastened to the concrete floor with clamp and concrete tap-con type screws. Also I have seen zip-ties throught the drain grate holding the pvc piping in place.
I noticed a posting by Mule that the 2009 code now has the floor drain out from under the water heater and furnace which I have seen done. The new code now will require the floor drain in a possible walking area creating a trip hazard if the condensate lines are fastened to the drain grate or floor. The architects draw a rectangle or box and plan review will have to catch the new code for floor drain location.
All your input in this matter is appreciated. I was called on it yesterday for where it was in the code that the pipe has to be fastened to the floor. :shock:
It is typical in this area to see the condensate piping along the floor near the furnace and fastened to the concrete floor with clamp and concrete tap-con type screws. Also I have seen zip-ties throught the drain grate holding the pvc piping in place.
I noticed a posting by Mule that the 2009 code now has the floor drain out from under the water heater and furnace which I have seen done. The new code now will require the floor drain in a possible walking area creating a trip hazard if the condensate lines are fastened to the drain grate or floor. The architects draw a rectangle or box and plan review will have to catch the new code for floor drain location.
All your input in this matter is appreciated. I was called on it yesterday for where it was in the code that the pipe has to be fastened to the floor. :shock:
Re: condensate drain line to floor drain
I was going off memory and could have sworn somewhere that condensate had to be through an air gap/indirect waste. Going from memory and not code I remembered...or thought that at one time the codes stated it had to be by indirect connection.
Chill water systems could possibly have cross connection to the potable water system. How it would get up to the system in above me but.........
So I guess this type of installation would be an AIR BREAK, not an AIR GAP.
AIR BREAK (Drainage System). A piping arrangement in
which a drain from a fixture, appliance or device discharges
indirectly into another fixture, receptacle or interceptor at a
point below the flood level rim and above the trap seal.
I hate it when the memory is wrong!!!! Didn't the code use to say.......never mind!
I was going off memory and could have sworn somewhere that condensate had to be through an air gap/indirect waste. Going from memory and not code I remembered...or thought that at one time the codes stated it had to be by indirect connection.
Chill water systems could possibly have cross connection to the potable water system. How it would get up to the system in above me but.........
So I guess this type of installation would be an AIR BREAK, not an AIR GAP.
AIR BREAK (Drainage System). A piping arrangement in
which a drain from a fixture, appliance or device discharges
indirectly into another fixture, receptacle or interceptor at a
point below the flood level rim and above the trap seal.
I hate it when the memory is wrong!!!! Didn't the code use to say.......never mind!
Re: condensate drain line to floor drain
Potable water supply and building drainage system connections to equipment and appliances regulated by this code shall be in accordance with the International Plumbing Code. IMC , Section 301.8.
I guess I'll stop there because the International Plumbing Code is not the adopted code here, the Uniform Plumbing Code is.
Potable water supply and building drainage system connections to equipment and appliances regulated by this code shall be in accordance with the International Plumbing Code. IMC , Section 301.8.
I guess I'll stop there because the International Plumbing Code is not the adopted code here, the Uniform Plumbing Code is.
JMORRISON
Silver Member
Re: condensate drain line to floor drain
UPC allows condensates to dump to Lav tailpiece-no air gap there
UPC allows condensates to dump to Lav tailpiece-no air gap there
skipharper
REGISTERED
Re: condensate drain line to floor drain
Basically, a simple way to determine if an air gap or air break is required is: will you put a cup under the outlet and drink whatever your cup is catching. If you say yes, I could drink it, air gap. Gross, I aint drinking that, air break. This applies most of the time. An exception to this rule is food prep sinks which are always air gap, and none of us would drink this. Another possible exception to the rule would be the drain board below a keg tap!!! :lol:
Hot water heater relief line is potable and is required to be air gap. Condensate water is not potable and therefore would be either an air gap or air break. Everything is allowed to be air gapped per The IPC, however, air break works for anything that one would not consume. Just my opinion.
Basically, a simple way to determine if an air gap or air break is required is: will you put a cup under the outlet and drink whatever your cup is catching. If you say yes, I could drink it, air gap. Gross, I aint drinking that, air break. This applies most of the time. An exception to this rule is food prep sinks which are always air gap, and none of us would drink this. Another possible exception to the rule would be the drain board below a keg tap!!! :lol:
Hot water heater relief line is potable and is required to be air gap. Condensate water is not potable and therefore would be either an air gap or air break. Everything is allowed to be air gapped per The IPC, however, air break works for anything that one would not consume. Just my opinion.
Re: condensate drain line to floor drain
Support/fastening of the condensate pipe in place is required per section 314.0 of the UPC. Airgap or airbreak required above the flood level of the rim per section 310.0 of the UMC and section 211.00 and 801.1 of the UPC.
2007 California Mechanical Code
Based on 2006 Uniform Mechanical Code
310.0 Condensate Wastes and Control.
310.1 Condensate Disposal. Condensate from air washers, air-cooling coils, fuel-burning condensing appliances, and the overflow from evaporative coolers and similar water-supplied equipment or similar air-conditioning equipment shall be collected and discharged to an approved plumbing fixture or disposal area. If discharged into the drainage system, equipment shall drain by means of an indirect waste pipe. The waste pipe shall have a slope of not less than 1/8 inch per foot (10.5 mm/m) or 1 percent slope and shall be of approved corrosion-resistant material not smaller than the outlet size as required in either Section 310.3 or 310.4 for air-cooling coils or condensing fuel-burning appliances, respectively. Condensate or wastewater shall not drain over a public way.
2007 California Plumbing Code
Based on 2006 Uniform Plumbing Code
211.0 Indirect Waste Pipe - A pipe that does not connect directly with tile drainage system but conveys liquid wastes by discharging into a plumbing fixture, interceptor, or receptacle that is directly connected to the drainage system.
801.1 Airgap or Airbreak Required. All indirect waste piping shall discharge into the building drainage system through an airgap or airbreak as set forth in this code. Where a drainage airgap is required by this code, the minimum vertical distance as measured from the lowest point of the indirect waste pipe or the fixture outlet to the flood-level rim of the receptor shall be not less than one (1) inch (25.4 cm).
314.0 Hangers and Supports.
314.1 Suspended piping shall be supported at intervals not to exceed those shown in Table 3-2.
314.2 All piping shall be supported in such a manner as to maintain its alignment and prevent sagging.
314.5 All piping, fixtures, appliances, and appurtenances shall be adequately supported in accordance with this code, the manufacturer's installation instructions, and as required by the Authority Having Jurisdiction.
Im sure it might be different in the I codes but we havn't adopted those parts yet.
Support/fastening of the condensate pipe in place is required per section 314.0 of the UPC. Airgap or airbreak required above the flood level of the rim per section 310.0 of the UMC and section 211.00 and 801.1 of the UPC.
2007 California Mechanical Code
Based on 2006 Uniform Mechanical Code
310.0 Condensate Wastes and Control.
310.1 Condensate Disposal. Condensate from air washers, air-cooling coils, fuel-burning condensing appliances, and the overflow from evaporative coolers and similar water-supplied equipment or similar air-conditioning equipment shall be collected and discharged to an approved plumbing fixture or disposal area. If discharged into the drainage system, equipment shall drain by means of an indirect waste pipe. The waste pipe shall have a slope of not less than 1/8 inch per foot (10.5 mm/m) or 1 percent slope and shall be of approved corrosion-resistant material not smaller than the outlet size as required in either Section 310.3 or 310.4 for air-cooling coils or condensing fuel-burning appliances, respectively. Condensate or wastewater shall not drain over a public way.
2007 California Plumbing Code
Based on 2006 Uniform Plumbing Code
211.0 Indirect Waste Pipe - A pipe that does not connect directly with tile drainage system but conveys liquid wastes by discharging into a plumbing fixture, interceptor, or receptacle that is directly connected to the drainage system.
801.1 Airgap or Airbreak Required. All indirect waste piping shall discharge into the building drainage system through an airgap or airbreak as set forth in this code. Where a drainage airgap is required by this code, the minimum vertical distance as measured from the lowest point of the indirect waste pipe or the fixture outlet to the flood-level rim of the receptor shall be not less than one (1) inch (25.4 cm).
314.0 Hangers and Supports.
314.1 Suspended piping shall be supported at intervals not to exceed those shown in Table 3-2.
314.2 All piping shall be supported in such a manner as to maintain its alignment and prevent sagging.
314.5 All piping, fixtures, appliances, and appurtenances shall be adequately supported in accordance with this code, the manufacturer's installation instructions, and as required by the Authority Having Jurisdiction.
Im sure it might be different in the I codes but we havn't adopted those parts yet.