Converting to Dry Standpipe System / Partial Fire Sprinkler

[jar546]

Mid-Rise condo, 8 floors, 70' to the finished floor of the 8th, 1960's construction.

Originally built with a wet standpipe and partial fire-sprinkler system, no interior fire sprinklers, just some near exterior stairwells and in the garbage chute.

Found out the system has been defunct for 10 years and now the building wants to remove the fire pump and make it a dry system and eliminate all of the fire sprinklers but 6.

We don't believe they can make this building any less safe because the building, an R2 with office and assembly space would require full fire sprinklers by today's standards.

What are your thoughts? NFPA 1, 101 & IBC 2018 apply.

 

[steveray]

No IEBC?

 

[bill1952]

I haven't looked but strongly suspect NFPA 101 requires retrofitting sprinklers in existing assembly occupancies. Maybe only over 300 occupants. I'll check.

 

[mtlogcabin]

I would say no, they cannot remove the system. They have to make it operational. ​

​

901.3Modifications.​

Persons shall not remove or modify any fire protection system installed or maintained under the provisions of this code or the Florida Fire Prevention Code without approval by the building official.

[F]903.2.11.3Buildings three stories or more in height.​

Any building which is of three stories or more in height shall be equipped with an approved automatic sprinkler system installed in accordance with Section 903.1.

Fl IEBC

 

[e hilton]

I would say either make the system fully functional to original design, or upgrade to current standards.

 

[ICE]

Found out the system has been defunct for 10 years and now the building wants to remove the fire pump and make it a dry system and eliminate all of the fire sprinklers but 6.

If that happened with this building it might be the same in other buildings. I don't know what schedule of routine inspections applies but apparently, inspections were not performed. Of course, that would be the Fire Department's problem.

The FD should be on the hook for deciding what temporary measures must be implemented until such time as the building is able to pass an inspection. Beyond that, the HOA board should face consequences for allowing the system to fail.

 

[Paul Sweet]

Even if it's allowed to be changed to a dry system I don't think the fire pump can be removed, unless the pressure in the municipal water system has increased since the building was built, and they can prove by calculations that it is now adequate without a fire pump.

BTW, fire pumps have to be tested regularly, and I've seen a case where the surge in pressure tripped the dry valve and filled the dry pipes, so they had to be manually drained afterwards.

 

[bill1952]

More and more this feels like it's on the owner to submit a design with calculations prepared by qualified sprinkler designer, that is code compliant - the original building and fire code plus and current code that might impact it. Let the designer put their name on it.

 

[jar546]

Even if it's allowed to be changed to a dry system I don't think the fire pump can be removed, unless the pressure in the municipal water system has increased since the building was built, and they can prove by calculations that it is now adequate without a fire pump.

BTW, fire pumps have to be tested regularly, and I've seen a case where the surge in pressure tripped the dry valve and filled the dry pipes, so they had to be manually drained afterwards.

The municipal water supply is a constant 54-55psi and there are more than 6 fire sprinklers covering all 8 stories, not to mention they never reconnected their standpipe system so the current system which is now defunct is only fed by the domestic line, yet another problem.

 

[TheCommish]

The building owner need to provide a report and code compliant means of effect the proposed change, repair or up grade done by a very competent RDP and probably a bigget pumpe 8 stories =80+ feet head loss from elevation to the top is about 40 PSI