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Egress

C

codenut

Member
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
Messages
9
Hello all ! I found yas finally :)

I’ve got a little question for everyone:

I have a business building with a café dining area off on one side. The café is, I think, primarily for employees use. On the other side of the café is two training rooms with an occupant load of around 50 to 75.

The question is this: Can the training rooms primary egress be through the dining area of the café?

We are at odds a little here batting this one around. We are looking through the 2000 LSC and the 2006 IBC, here in Georgia the LSC has presidence over the IBC on egress issues.

What is your take on it?
 
Re: Egress

I'd say yes as long as the means of egress did not pass through the kitchen. See LSC 39.2.5 which sends you to 7.5.1.7, and also see 7.5.2.1. Obviously travel distance, common path, etc. come into play.
 
Re: Egress

Hey Jake,

Well 7.5.1.7 is the one that is hanging us up. "Exit acess from rooms or spaces shall be permitted to be through an adjoining or intervening rooms or areas, PROVIDED that such adjoining rooms are acessory to the area served...." The cafe dining area is not accessory to the training rooms. Thats our hang up here.
 
Re: Egress

It has changed in the 2009 IBC for the exact reason you are stumbling on right now. I was the proponent of the code change that inserted the language "accessory to one or the other." If you were using the 2009 edition, you could egress through that area.

2009 IBC Language:

1014.2 Egress through intervening spaces. Egress through intervening spaces shall comply with this section.

1. Egress from a room or space shall not pass through adjoining or intervening rooms or areas except where such adjoining rooms or areas and the area served are accessory to one or the other, are not a Group H occupancy and provide a discernible path of egress travel to an exit.

Exception: Means of egress are not prohibited through adjoining or intervening rooms or spaces in a Group H, S or F occupancy when the adjoining or intervening rooms or spaces are the same or a lesser hazard occupancy group.
 
Re: Egress

"Accessory to" is kind of a nebulous term. Is the training room accessory to the cafe or is the cafe accessory to the training room? I think either could be true. I would pass it.

Welcome back, codenut!

GPE
 
Re: Egress

Yeah I know acessory to ...what which? It seems the 2009 addresses it nicely by saying "either or" but unfortunately I wont be seeing that until 2013 or so :(

HEY GPE, Yeah thanks! :)
 
Re: Egress

I think Sec. 1014.2.1 Multiple tenants. will give you an answer. IBC 2006
 
Re: Egress

I would accept it as long as the means of egress is sufficient for simultaneous occupancy of the cafe and both training rooms. I can't find a definition of accessory in the LSC, so the LSC says to use Websters. See definition of accessory in Websters:

2 a : a thing of secondary or subordinate importance : adjunct b : an object or device not essential in itself but adding to the beauty, convenience, or effectiveness of something else

Does the cafe meet the above, and/or this section of IBC 2006?

508.3.1 Accessory occupancies.

Accessory occupancies are those occupancies subsidiary to the main occupancy of the building or portion thereof. Aggregate accessory occupancies shall not occupy more than 10 percent of the area of the story in which they are located and shall not exceed the tabular values in Table 503, without height and area increases in accordance with Sections 504 and 506 for such accessory occupancies.

Exceptions:

1. Accessory assembly areas having a floor area less than 750 square feet (69.7 m2) are not considered separate occupancies.
 
Re: Egress

well sorta

The egress seems to be ok for both, however based on the definitions ......its sorta accessory.

The room actually has a folding wall deviding it in two. the three spaces (the two rooms, the dining room and the kitchen) are all seperated from the main building by a 1 hour fire wall and its a sprinklered building. Now taking into account the size are we talking about the rooms? the dining area? The entire assembly occupany? It may exceed the 10% of the floor area depending on which one were talking about.
 
Re: Egress

same people, right?

Go to training.. break.. pick up a doughnut and go to the break room (or check voice mails and stay in the training room)... fire alarm goes off..

No issue..
 
Re: Egress

Seems I finally found the Building Code section of the forum.

I agree with those others and as a LSC user and instructor for what seems forever........ the simple answer is yes and is such provided the area is not more hazardous (i.e. kitchens, boiler rooms, electrical equipment rooms and similar mechanical spaces) then the area being retreated from and provided their is a clear path/width and capacity of egress travel to and through the exit.
 
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