elevators

[Yousef Eshmawi]

We've designed a community center in Alabama. It's a PMB building. Mainly 1 story, the 2nd story was previously labeled a "mezzanine," but we added two activity to the upstairs, and there is a running/walking track as well there. 1st Floor square footage is 28,200 square feet and has two large court rooms, a lobby and other function rooms, 2nd is 8,300 sq ft roughly. And the design is for 1,450 occupants.
We've found that per 2010 ADA requirements we have to have an accessible passenger elevator. This requirement is deemed too expensive for the purpose of adding the 2 activity rooms upstairs, and they are deciding to remove the elevator and these rooms upstairs and returning to its "mezzanine" status and lower occupancy count. Does anyone know a way we could still make this work, be considered "compliant," without the need for an elevator? Since it's shooting up costs so.

 

[classicT]

To avoid the elevator, keep the mezzanine to less than 3000sf. If you exceed 3000sf, an accessible route is required per 1104.4.

Alabama Building Code​

2021 IBC​

1104.4 Multistory Buildings and Facilities​

At least one accessible route shall connect each accessible story, mezzanine and occupied roofs in multilevel buildings and facilities.
Exceptions:

1. An accessible route is not required to stories, mezzanines and occupied roofs that have an aggregate area of not more than 3,000 square feet (278.7 m2) and are located above and below accessible levels. This exception shall not apply to:
   
   1. Multiple tenant facilities of Group M occupancies containing five or more tenant spaces used for the sales or rental of goods and where at least one such tenant space is located on a floor level above or below the accessible levels.
   2. Stories or mezzanines containing offices of health care providers (Group B or I).
   3. Passenger transportation facilities and airports (Group A-3 or B).
   4. Government buildings.
   5. Structures with four or more dwelling units.
2. Stories, mezzanines or occupied roofs that do not contain accessible elements or other spaces as determined by Section 1108 or 1109 are not required to be served by an accessible route from an accessible level.
3. In air traffic control towers, an accessible route is not required to serve the cab and the floor immediately below the cab.
4. Where a two-story building or facility has one story or mezzanine with an occupant load of five or fewer persons that does not contain public use space, that story or mezzanine shall not be required to be connected by an accessible route to the story above or below.

 

[TheCommish]

The codes most often do not consider cost as a compliance alternative, especially change of use and discrimination. I often explain if an able-bodied person can access to a portion of the building those less able have to have equal access. In Massachusetts because of the change of use and the 2nd floor being a public area the elevator would have to be installed. The only option to remove the elevator would have the mezzanine be an employ only area, it then would be a DOJ issue if an employee need access to the space.

 

[Yikes]

Is the community center owned or operated or financially supported by a governmental entity?

 

[classicT]

The codes most often do not consider cost as a compliance alternative, especially change of use and discrimination. I often explain if an able-bodied person can access to a portion of the building those less able have to have equal access. In Massachusetts because of the change of use and the 2nd floor being a public area the elevator would have to be installed. The only option to remove the elevator would have the mezzanine be an employ only area, it then would be a DOJ issue if an employee need access to the space.

I took the OP to be indicating that this was new construction, with changes to the plan being concurrent with construction. If that is the case, then existing building code provisions do not apply (i.e. change of use).

 

[Yankee Chronicler]

We've designed a community center in Alabama. It's a PMB building. Mainly 1 story, the 2nd story was previously labeled a "mezzanine," but we added two activity to the upstairs, and there is a running/walking track as well there. 1st Floor square footage is 28,200 square feet and has two large court rooms, a lobby and other function rooms, 2nd is 8,300 sq ft roughly. And the design is for 1,450 occupants.

Never mind what the upper level was "labeled." Is it a mezzanine? Read the definition. Is it An intermediate level between the floor and ceiling of the main story? Remember that the criteria for limiting the size of a mezzanine say that it cannot exceed one-third of the area of the floor area of the room or space in which it is located. How is this "mezzanine" accessed? Is it IN a room or space? If it doesn't have a stair from a room that's three times the area of the mezzanine and if the mezzanine isn't open to that room (yes, there are exceptions), then IMHO you don't have a mezzanine, you have a story.

Just went through that argument on a project. The designer is a PE who is playing at being an architect, and playing badly. He insists the upper level is a mezzanine even though the state building inspector agrees with us that it's a story. You can't make a story into a mezzanine just by labeling it with the 'M' word, and it's not based solely on the relative gross floor areas of the two levels.

 

[TheCommish]

Is the community center owned or operated or financially supported by a governmental entity?

I saw previously labeled mezzanine as remolding, you are correct this seems to be new construction, my answer for Mass. is the same. I think if the project was in AL, and was under 3000 sf you are correct, the OP is in CA, from what I see on this for use unless CA has similar language to AL elevator seem to be required