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Fixtures vs Facilities in Table 403.1

Discussion in 'Commercial Plumbing Codes' started by georgia plans exam, Nov 16, 2017.

  1. georgia plans exam

    georgia plans exam Silver Member

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    Does anyone know why footnote "d" to Table 403.1 (2012 IPC) refers to the minimum number of "facilities" required, rather than the number of "fixtures"?
    Thanks, GPE.
     
  2. Rick18071

    Rick18071 Sawhorse

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    Good one. I wonder if it is a misprint. says the same thing in the 2009.
     
  3. mtlogcabin

    mtlogcabin Sawhorse

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    403.2 through 403.4 deal with facilities and minimum requirements
     
  4. rgrace

    rgrace Sawhorse

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    That is a good question. Thought provoking :)
    Facilities contain plumbing fixtures. The location of a facility is limited by distance. The number of facilities is dictated by the number of occupants (minimum two facilities, discounting exceptions, on for each sex) and distance. Depending on the location of the seasonal outdoor seating and entertainment areas under A-1, A-2 and A-3, additional facilities may be required based on distance. The bigger question now is, if the intent was to verify distances to facilities, is the additional occupant load required to be included in the minimum plumbing fixture count? This footnote doesn't really say that it is. If it did, it would end with "shall be included when determining the minimum number of plumbing fixtures and facilities required."
     
  5. rgrace

    rgrace Sawhorse

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    FYI, 2015 and 2018 has the same language as well.
     
  6. Builder Bob

    Builder Bob Sawhorse

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    The first time I see that language is in the 2006 IPC , it has a black bar indicating a code change, You may have to go to the archives to see what the intent of this"language" is....
     
  7. mark handler

    mark handler Sawhorse

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    Base on the definition, in dictionary, not code book.
    A facility can contain many fixtures. Case in point a education facility can contain many classrooms or resroom facilities

    But a fixture can not.
     
    JBI likes this.
  8. HForester

    HForester Member

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    I dug back into the old proposal books to find that "facilities" is what was in the approved proposal (by Ballanco)
     
  9. ADAguy

    ADAguy Sawhorse

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    Interesting to note that distance to facilities is only addressed for A occupancies, what of E occupancies?
     
  10. mark handler

    mark handler Sawhorse

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    Based on my contact with DSA, In CA, ASS-U-ME the students are "customers".... upload_2017-12-15_11-14-16.png
     
  11. ADAguy

    ADAguy Sawhorse

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    Well over 100 yards, how fast can a manual or electric wc cover that distance? < 20 sec's?
     
  12. Builder Bob

    Builder Bob Sawhorse

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    Same as I - Codes IPC 403.3.3 or IBC 2902.3.2.
     
  13. georgia plans exam

    georgia plans exam Silver Member

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    Thank you all for your replies. I had an applicant who wanted to use the wording in the footnote as an argument that the code saw no difference between facility and fixture. He did not want to provide separate facilities for each sex. long story but, he lost the argument. Thanks again...GPE.
     
  14. Francis Vineyard

    Francis Vineyard Sawhorse

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    Noted the footnote d is applicable to A-1, A-2 & A-3; not A-5 that would provide permanent (seasonal) facilities. Therefore could the other assembly groups provide portable facilities during the outdoor events (Ref. IBC E105.1)?
     
  15. georgia plans exam

    georgia plans exam Silver Member

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    Oops. Accidental double post.
     
  16. georgia plans exam

    georgia plans exam Silver Member

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    The footnote was not even applicable to the project. The applicant was trying to justify a code violation by quoting what, I beli
     
  17. georgia plans exam

    georgia plans exam Silver Member

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    believe is a poorly written footnote. GPE.
     

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