mark handler
SAWHORSE
If my post was a "duh", the OP would not have happened.brudgers said:
There are no "duh" questions, if the person does not know the answer
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House of worship & ADA
- Thread starter tbz
- Start date
There are no "duh" questions, if the person does not know the answer
mark handler
SAWHORSE
image projected, is image reflected.brudgers said:
Architect1281
REGISTERED
Subpart A -- General
Sec.36.101 Purpose.
The purpose of this part is to implement title III of the Americans with Disabilities Act of 1990 (42 U.S.C. 12181), which prohibits discrimination on the basis of disability by public accommodations and requires places of public accommodation and commercial facilities to be designed, constructed, and altered in compliance with the accessibility standards established by this part.
Sec.36.102 Application.
(a) General. This part applies to any --
(1) Public accommodation;
(2) Commercial facility; or
(3) Private entity that offers examinations or courses related to applications, licensing, certification, or credentialing for secondary or postsecondary education, professional, or trade purposes.
(b) Public accommodations. (1) The requirements of this part applicable to public accommodations are set forth insubparts B, C, and D of this part.
(2) The requirements of subparts B and C of this part obligate a public accommodation only with respect to the operations of a place of public accommodation.
(3) The requirements of subpart D of this part obligate a public accommodation only with respect to --
(i) A facility used as, or designed or constructed for use as, a place of public accommodation; or
(ii) A facility used as, or designed and constructed for use as, a commercial facility.
© Commercial facilities. The requirements of this part applicable to commercial facilities are set forth in subpart D of this part.
(d) Examinations and courses. The requirements of this part applicable to private entities that offer examinations or courses as specified in paragraph (a) of this section are set forth in Sec.36.309.
(e) Exemptions and exclusions. This part does not apply to any private club (except to the extent that the facilities of the private club are made available to customers or patrons of a place of public accommodation), or to any religious entity or public entity.
Had a group come in proud as could be that said THE DOJ says A church does not have to comply with the ADA
so I asked them for the DOJ interpretation that said they did not have to comply with the Buildiong Code
Still Waiting
Sec.36.101 Purpose.
The purpose of this part is to implement title III of the Americans with Disabilities Act of 1990 (42 U.S.C. 12181), which prohibits discrimination on the basis of disability by public accommodations and requires places of public accommodation and commercial facilities to be designed, constructed, and altered in compliance with the accessibility standards established by this part.
Sec.36.102 Application.
(a) General. This part applies to any --
(1) Public accommodation;
(2) Commercial facility; or
(3) Private entity that offers examinations or courses related to applications, licensing, certification, or credentialing for secondary or postsecondary education, professional, or trade purposes.
(b) Public accommodations. (1) The requirements of this part applicable to public accommodations are set forth insubparts B, C, and D of this part.
(2) The requirements of subparts B and C of this part obligate a public accommodation only with respect to the operations of a place of public accommodation.
(3) The requirements of subpart D of this part obligate a public accommodation only with respect to --
(i) A facility used as, or designed or constructed for use as, a place of public accommodation; or
(ii) A facility used as, or designed and constructed for use as, a commercial facility.
© Commercial facilities. The requirements of this part applicable to commercial facilities are set forth in subpart D of this part.
(d) Examinations and courses. The requirements of this part applicable to private entities that offer examinations or courses as specified in paragraph (a) of this section are set forth in Sec.36.309.
(e) Exemptions and exclusions. This part does not apply to any private club (except to the extent that the facilities of the private club are made available to customers or patrons of a place of public accommodation), or to any religious entity or public entity.
Had a group come in proud as could be that said THE DOJ says A church does not have to comply with the ADA
so I asked them for the DOJ interpretation that said they did not have to comply with the Buildiong Code
Still Waiting
Gene Boecker
REGISTERED
The IBC clearly does not exclude churches. I can't find that anywhere in Chapter 1, Chapter 11 or any other chapter. IN fact, Chapter 3 clearly lists churches as being a part of Occupancy Group A-3!Architect1281 said:
If the local AHJ adopts the ADAAG as the standard (as happens from place to place), they need to define in the scoping what is covered and what is not since the ADAAG does not identify scoping to the extent that the ADA does itself - nor does the rest of the IBC. Churches are covered by the Building Code - but not the ADA.
EXCEPT when they are (or parts are made) public accommodation.. they the building is in play..
Show me a church that doesn't have a day care or open (rent) itself to non church related business.. very few (here anyway)...
The church has the whole church/state thing going for it.. once they are ANYTHING but a place of worship, it's a horse of a different color.... legally as well as actually.
Show me a church that doesn't have a day care or open (rent) itself to non church related business.. very few (here anyway)...
The church has the whole church/state thing going for it.. once they are ANYTHING but a place of worship, it's a horse of a different color.... legally as well as actually.
Paul Sweet
SAWHORSE
This exemption has little to do with the separation of church and state. ADA is an extension ofthe 1964 civil rights law. Churches and private clubs were exempted from that law, which is why they are exempted from ADA.
ADA is not a building code. It is a set of standards which you can be sued if you don't meet, and the U.S. Dept. of Justice may join the suit on the plaintiff's side.
IBC & ANSI A17.1 accessibility requirements are 99% identical to ADAAG, and they apply to almost all new construction, including churches and private clubs. IBC Chapter 34 has even copied ADAAG's requirment to upgrade existing elements when renovation buildings.
ADA is not a building code. It is a set of standards which you can be sued if you don't meet, and the U.S. Dept. of Justice may join the suit on the plaintiff's side.
IBC & ANSI A17.1 accessibility requirements are 99% identical to ADAAG, and they apply to almost all new construction, including churches and private clubs. IBC Chapter 34 has even copied ADAAG's requirment to upgrade existing elements when renovation buildings.
FredK
Gold Member
I'm with Paul.Paul Sweet said:
not all that identical in all states (which may/may not have a DOJ buy in).. Florida, for example used to (and I assume still does) require a totally accessible toilet stall.. sink included inside the stall)... once DOJ buys in.. it's the law...
DOJ will almost always join in... or they can (and sometimes do) bring the case based on complaints.
ADA has never been a building code issue.. it's always been civil rights legislation.. (the federal government, conveniently, exempts themselves).
When individuals get compensation for bringing a suit, rather than forcing the building owner to comply.. that's the real problem.
DOJ will almost always join in... or they can (and sometimes do) bring the case based on complaints.
ADA has never been a building code issue.. it's always been civil rights legislation.. (the federal government, conveniently, exempts themselves).
When individuals get compensation for bringing a suit, rather than forcing the building owner to comply.. that's the real problem.
alora
Silver Member
What makes you think the federal government exempts itself?peach said:
They follow ABA.
mark handler
SAWHORSE
Congress Is expressly exempt from the provisions of the ADA. Not the entire federal government.alora said:
The Florida Accessibility Code is part of the building code. It is also certified by the DOJ because it is based on ADAAG and only contains more stringent provisions - if you look at ADAAG and FAC side by side you can see how little was changed for the FAC.peach said:
The big ones are no general exemption for vertical accessibility and the sink in the accessible toilet stall.