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integration of fire alarm system with security alarm system
- Thread starter geokser
- Start date
Builder Bob
SAWHORSE
I know of a few (very) alarm panels that are listed that are for commercial use as a fire alarm and security panel.
If you do a search, you will see alot of different opinions about this issue and really will be an AHJ call ---
If you do a search, you will see alot of different opinions about this issue and really will be an AHJ call ---
Coug Dad
Platinum Member
Welcome. My opinion that mixing a fire alarm with any other system (BMS, Security) is a bad idea. There are always problems down the road as one of the systems ages and needs to be replaced.
FM William Burns
REGISTERED
We only permit a combination system where as permitted in NFPA 72 and the system is partitioned for separate alarm, supervisory and control functions. The fire system SHALL comply with all provisions of 72 for power supply etc..................
IMO I would suggest keeping the systems seperate.
Both systems have features that are unique to themselves and you tend to lose those advanced features in a combination systems.
I have been an system installer / tech for 15 years and have seen both and have always had happier customers with seperate systems.
Both systems have features that are unique to themselves and you tend to lose those advanced features in a combination systems.
I have been an system installer / tech for 15 years and have seen both and have always had happier customers with seperate systems.
He has not said what he is trying to do
1. Use one panel to run the whole building?
2. Use the fire alarm to release the mag locks on the high security bathroom??
3. Some other security thing that involves the fire alarm system working WITH the security system???
1. Use one panel to run the whole building?
2. Use the fire alarm to release the mag locks on the high security bathroom??
3. Some other security thing that involves the fire alarm system working WITH the security system???
apology
Yes, it is in a commercial setting.
My concern is - without integration, would the fire alarm be drowned out by burglary alarm or would a burgler raises the fire alarm when he accidentally triggered off the burglary alarm to confuse the owner? There are many combination system available in the market but was told by builder that the combination system is prohibited in California but could not locate the specific clause that stipulates this requirement.
I do note some cities are clearly requiring this separation in residential single family homes but silent on multiple family homes.
Any help to point the way would be appreciated.
My apology. Have not been able to log into the net due to some glitches and was caught up with other matters.cda said:
Yes, it is in a commercial setting.
My concern is - without integration, would the fire alarm be drowned out by burglary alarm or would a burgler raises the fire alarm when he accidentally triggered off the burglary alarm to confuse the owner? There are many combination system available in the market but was told by builder that the combination system is prohibited in California but could not locate the specific clause that stipulates this requirement.
I do note some cities are clearly requiring this separation in residential single family homes but silent on multiple family homes.
Any help to point the way would be appreciated.
Not in the burgling business, but I see most burglar alarms on commercial as silent alarms that report to a monitoring company, and maybe have one horn and flashing light.
Not to much can drown out a fire alarm system
in most nfpa 72 fire alarm systems the panel has to be listed for commercial fire alarm, yes there are panels out there the carry both fire and burglar, just have not seen one in many moons
3.3.92* Fire Alarm Control Unit. (FACU) A component of the fire alarm system, provided with primary and secondary power sources, which receives signals from initiating devices or other fire alarm control units, and processes these signals to determine part or all of the required fire alarm system output function(s). (SIG-PRO)
A.3.3.92 Fire Alarm Control Unit. (FACU) In addition to the functions identified in the definition, a fire alarm control unit might have an integral operator interface, supply power to detection devices, notification appliances, transponder(s), or off-premises transmitter(s) or any combination of these. The control unit might also provide transfer of condition to relay or devices connected to the control unit. There can be multiple fire alarm control units in a fire alarm system.
3.2.5* Listed. Equipment, materials, or services included in a list published by an organization that is acceptable to the authority having jurisdiction and concerned with evaluation of products or services, that maintains periodic inspection of production of listed equipment or materials or periodic evaluation of services, and whose listing states that either the equipment, material, or service meets appropriate designated standards or has been tested and found suitable for a specified purpose.
10.3 Equipment.
10.3.1 Equipment constructed and installed in conformity with this Code shall be listed for the purpose for which it is used.
10.3.2 System components shall be installed, tested, and maintained in accordance with the manufacturer’s published instructions and this Code.
10.3.3* All devices and appliances that receive their power from the initiating device circuit or signaling line circuit of a control unit shall be listed for use with the control unit.
sorry as to your original question yes there are fire and burglar listed panels out ther, will calif. allow them, do not know, and may be by city
Not to much can drown out a fire alarm system
in most nfpa 72 fire alarm systems the panel has to be listed for commercial fire alarm, yes there are panels out there the carry both fire and burglar, just have not seen one in many moons
3.3.92* Fire Alarm Control Unit. (FACU) A component of the fire alarm system, provided with primary and secondary power sources, which receives signals from initiating devices or other fire alarm control units, and processes these signals to determine part or all of the required fire alarm system output function(s). (SIG-PRO)
A.3.3.92 Fire Alarm Control Unit. (FACU) In addition to the functions identified in the definition, a fire alarm control unit might have an integral operator interface, supply power to detection devices, notification appliances, transponder(s), or off-premises transmitter(s) or any combination of these. The control unit might also provide transfer of condition to relay or devices connected to the control unit. There can be multiple fire alarm control units in a fire alarm system.
3.2.5* Listed. Equipment, materials, or services included in a list published by an organization that is acceptable to the authority having jurisdiction and concerned with evaluation of products or services, that maintains periodic inspection of production of listed equipment or materials or periodic evaluation of services, and whose listing states that either the equipment, material, or service meets appropriate designated standards or has been tested and found suitable for a specified purpose.
10.3 Equipment.
10.3.1 Equipment constructed and installed in conformity with this Code shall be listed for the purpose for which it is used.
10.3.2 System components shall be installed, tested, and maintained in accordance with the manufacturer’s published instructions and this Code.
10.3.3* All devices and appliances that receive their power from the initiating device circuit or signaling line circuit of a control unit shall be listed for use with the control unit.
sorry as to your original question yes there are fire and burglar listed panels out ther, will calif. allow them, do not know, and may be by city
for a fire alarm panel it should carry a UL 864 lisiting just for the "fire" I do not know what the listing is for burglar possibly UL 681
http://ulstandardsinfonet.ul.com/scopes/scopes.asp?fn=0864.html
for example:::
Compliances;
NFPA 72, UL Commercial Fire, UL864 9th Ed., SIA CP01, UL985. UL household & commercial burg.: UL1610, UL609, UL365, UL1023. NYC FD; CSFM (fire).
http://www.napcosecurity.com/napcspecs.htm
http://ulstandardsinfonet.ul.com/scopes/scopes.asp?fn=0864.html
for example:::
Compliances;
NFPA 72, UL Commercial Fire, UL864 9th Ed., SIA CP01, UL985. UL household & commercial burg.: UL1610, UL609, UL365, UL1023. NYC FD; CSFM (fire).
http://www.napcosecurity.com/napcspecs.htm
Last edited by a moderator:
HI,According to my personal view the security cameras ,security alarms and other anti theft alarms have the become the necessity of the day,because we are living in such country where the materialistic things are more valuable than an person's life.so I think every body should install such cameras and alarms for saving our lives and property.
HI,According to my personal view the security cameras ,security alarms and other anti theft alarms have the become the necessity of the day,because we are living in such country where the materialistic things are more valuable than an person's life.so I think every body should install such cameras and alarms for saving our lives and property.
home alarm Brisbane
home alarm Brisbane