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Introduction and quick question

latees40

Registered User
Joined
Feb 20, 2024
Messages
7
Location
NC
Good Morning, I am new to this forum and have a quick question.
Background: I have an A-1 assembly hall that was a repurpose suite 4500sqft. This May will be two years to when my lease started so I am a bit frustrated because i have not received my CO. I was issued permits for electrical, plumbing, fire safety and Mechanical. The Plumbing inspection and Mechanical passed in December and January. I have had 4 final electrical inspections partial passed.

I was up for my final electrical inspection and fire rough-in. I was sure my final fire inspection would pass because there were four items on the list and all had been completed. In walks this totally different inspector, He says to me is this your first inspection I say no he asked me the name of the person that completed the first four I gave him his name he said let me call him and see if he can come later today because If I start new you will not pass this inspection because I will find something he asked me if I wanted to reschedule I said yes. He went to his car came back and said the inspector did not answer his phone but he will try again and let me know. He sat in his car for over an hour so I thought the inspection would be rescheduled. As I was leaving he started toward my car and said the other inspector told him to go ahead and complete the inspection. and that the first inspector said he had not gone on the roof yet. We got inside and he started talking about fire wall Which i didn't know he would address but I had add a 1hr fire retardant paint additive and painted the wall. He looked at me like I had 3 eyes and said there is no such thing as a paint that could make the wall a 2hr, I showed him the paint additive he called the bldg inspector talked about me and this paint like i was not there. got off the phone had questions about the chandeliers that were installed before the plans, the roof which I told him I have several ladder and he made no attempt to go outside to inspect the roof. He name several new items, completed his inspection then asked if I wanted him to start the fire inspection I said no and he left and canceled the fire inspection. He could tell I was upset. He asked me to get permit for the chandelier that has been there before I hired an architect. I cried after he left. Is there any recourse what options do I have to not get a new permit for the chandeliers and have the same inspector complete what he started.
 
We got inside and he started talking about fire wall Which i didn't know he would address but I had add a 1hr fire retardant paint additive and painted the wall. He looked at me like I had 3 eyes and said there is no such thing as a paint that could make the wall a 2hr, I showed him the paint additive he called the bldg inspector talked about me and this paint like i was not there.
He is right, there is no paint that can make a 1-hour wall into a 2-hr wall. If such a product exists, it would have to be tested in a laboratory on a wall that is exactly like the one you have and there would have to be a testing sheet produced by the laboratory that shows it passed the test.
He says to me is this your first inspection I say no he asked me the name of the person that completed the first four I gave him his name he said let me call him and see if he can come later today because If I start new you will not pass this inspection because I will find something he asked me if I wanted to reschedule I said yes. He went to his car came back and said the inspector did not answer his phone but he will try again and let me know. He sat in his car for over an hour so I thought the inspection would be rescheduled. As I was leaving he started toward my car and said the other inspector told him to go ahead and complete the inspection.
Not many would have waited and gave you that courtesy. This inspector's customer service is a cut above.
He name several new items, completed his inspection then asked if I wanted him to start the fire inspection I said no and he left and canceled the fire inspection. He could tell I was upset.
Again, very reasonable, in fact a little too nice to let you call another inspector to potentially approve something that is clearly wrong.
He asked me to get permit for the chandelier that has been there before I hired an architect.
Quite reasonable if the chandelier and associated wiring needed a permit before and was installed without one.
Good Morning, I am new to this forum and have a quick question.
Background: I have an A-1 assembly hall that was a repurpose suite 4500sqft. This May will be two years to when my lease started so I am a bit frustrated because i have not received my CO. I was issued permits for electrical, plumbing, fire safety and Mechanical. The Plumbing inspection and Mechanical passed in December and January. I have had 4 final electrical inspections partial passed.
Is there any recourse what options do I have to not get a new permit for the chandeliers and have the same inspector complete what he started.
Were only trade permits pulled to avoid needing a licensed contractor/building permit? It sounds like you don't have a licensed contractor looking out for you?

I recommend fixing the violations and call for inspection. You seem to have stumbled into a situation where a competent inspector followed one who was less so. The problem is not the competent guy - he's probably the only one who did his job and knows what is going on. The fact that he waited around for an hour and then gave you an out indicates to me that he is not making up requirements to damage you, he's doing the best he can to do his job with as little collateral damage as possible.
 
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He is right, there is no paint that can make a 1-hour wall into a 2-hr wall. If such a product exists, it would have to be tested in a laboratory on a wall that is exactly like the one you have and there would have to be a testing sheet produced by the laboratory that shows it passed the test.
There is a Fire Retardant Pint additive and the building inspector confirmed it while he was on the phone with the electrical inspector. Just because he was not aware of it doesn't mean it does not exist beside he is an electrician not a fire inspector or building inspector. I expected one of them to address this in the plan the fire flame paint additive was approved for use.
Not many would have waited and gave you that courtesy. This inspector's customer service is a cut above.

Again, very reasonable, in fact a little too nice to let you call another inspector to potentially approve something that is clearly wrong.

Quite reasonable if the chandelier and associated wiring needed a permit before and was installed without one.

Were only trade permits pulled to avoid needing a licensed contractor/building permit? It sounds like you don't have a licensed contractor looking out for you?

I recommend fixing the violations and call for inspection. You seem to have stumbled into a situation where a competent inspector followed one who was less so. The problem is not the competent guy - he's probably the only one who did his job and knows what is going on. The fact that he waited around for an hour and then gave you an out indicates to me that he is not making up requirements to damage you, he's doing the best he can to do his job with as little collateral damage as possible.
 
There is a Fire Retardant Pint additive and the building inspector confirmed it while he was on the phone with the electrical inspector. Just because he was not aware of it doesn't mean it does not exist beside he is an electrician not a fire inspector or building inspector. I expected one of them to address this in the plan the fire flame paint additive was approved for use.
He is right, there is no paint that can make a 1-hour wall into a 2-hr wall. If such a product exists, it would have to be tested in a laboratory on a wall that is exactly like the one you have and there would have to be a testing sheet produced by the laboratory that shows it passed the test.

Not many would have waited and gave you that courtesy. This inspector's customer service is a cut above.

Again, very reasonable, in fact a little too nice to let you call another inspector to potentially approve something that is clearly wrong.

Quite reasonable if the chandelier and associated wiring needed a permit before and was installed without one.

Were only trade permits pulled to avoid needing a licensed contractor/building permit? It sounds like you don't have a licensed contractor looking out for you?

I have a licensed contractor and a architect they issued the permits needed according to the plans submitted.
I recommend fixing the violations and call for inspection. You seem to have stumbled into a situation where a competent inspector followed one who was less so. The problem is not the competent guy - he's probably the only one who did his job and knows what is going on. The fact that he waited around for an hour and then gave you an out indicates to me that he is not making up requirements to damage you, he's doing the best he can to do his job with as little collateral damage as possible.
 
I have a licensed contractor and a architect they issued the permits needed according to the plans submitted.
Again, very reasonable, in fact a little too nice to let you call another inspector to potentially approve something that is clearly wrong.
It was his idea to call the inspector but he had no idea what was clearly wrong because he had not looked at the space at that point. They guy had a nasty attitude and was determined not to pass the inspection before it even started apparently you did not read my comment
 
There is a Fire Retardant Pint additive and the building inspector confirmed it while he was on the phone with the electrical inspector. Just because he was not aware of it doesn't mean it does not exist beside he is an electrician not a fire inspector or building inspector. I expected one of them to address this in the plan the fire flame paint additive was approved for use.
What was approved on the plans?

I agree with @Beniah Naylor, there is not any intumescent paint that I have seen listed for application on a 1-hr wall that will up it to a 2-hr assembly. It may exist, but it would not be on the building inspector to approve - it needs to be on the plans and approved by the design professional and the AHJ's plans examiner/BO.
 
There is a Fire Retardant Pint additive and the building inspector confirmed it while he was on the phone with the electrical inspector. Just because he was not aware of it doesn't mean it does not exist beside he is an electrician not a fire inspector or building inspector. I expected one of them to address this in the plan the fire flame paint additive was approved for use.
Do you have a picture of this product, or a brand/product name?
 
What was approved on the plans?

I agree with @Beniah Naylor, there is not any intumescent paint that I have seen listed for application on a 1-hr wall that will up it to a 2-hr assembly. It may exist, but it would not be on the building inspector to approve - it needs to be on the plans and approved by the design professional and the AHJ's plans examiner/BO.
And it would require Special Inspections per 1705.15 or 1705 .16 or 1705.1.1......IMO
 
I'm going to chime in as well: I have yet to see *any* UL(C)-listed assembly that uses intumescent paint to achieve a fire-resistance rating.

I have seen a paint-like intumescent product applied to site-batched sprayfoam to provide a modest fire barrier equivalent to protecting with plywood or OSB, but that's a totally different beast.

Just because somebody read a label saying "this will do X" doesn't mean it meets Code.
 
There are also some [VERY expensive] intumescent paint products that are listed for application to structural steel. I am not aware that any of those products have ever been tested to show that they increase the rating of a 1-hour assembly to 2-hours.

Latees40, what is the specific product you used? What accredited testing agency came up with the listing for it in applications like yours? Does it have an ICC ESR number?
 
What was approved on the plans?

I agree with @Beniah Naylor, there is not any intumescent paint that I have seen listed for application on a 1-hr wall that will up it to a 2-hr assembly. It may exist, but it would not be on the building inspector to approve - it needs to be on the plans and approved by the design professional and the AHJ's plans examiner/BO.
Thanks for your reply there is such paint and paint additives maybe research before replying. It is on the plans the guy that inspected is not the building inspector but the electrical inspector. It was confirmed with the building inspector that it existed. I believe the issue is you can not have regular electrical outlets in a fire wall. This is being addressed by my architect and contractor to remove the regular outlets
 
I'm going to chime in as well: I have yet to see *any* UL(C)-listed assembly that uses intumescent paint to achieve a fire-resistance rating.

I have seen a paint-like intumescent product applied to site-batched sprayfoam to provide a modest fire barrier equivalent to protecting with plywood or OSB, but that's a totally different beast.

Just because somebody read a label saying "this will do X" doesn't mean it meets Code.
It exists and was the only thing that made sense at the time because the suites already existed with tenants on each side of my suite. It didn’t make sense for us to start adding sheet rock etc to create a two hour fire wall but the issue is with having a regular outlet in the firewall and not the firewall itself which the architect and contractor is addressing,
 
latees40, if the product is named on the construction documents, you have access to that information. Please tell us the name of the product so we can read up on it. Also, you use the term firewall, but is this a "firewall" as defined in the code, or is it a "fire barrier" (used to separate two different occupancies) or a "fire partition"?
 
Thanks for your reply there is such paint and paint additives maybe research before replying. It is on the plans the guy that inspected is not the building inspector but the electrical inspector. It was confirmed with the building inspector that it existed. I believe the issue is you can not have regular electrical outlets in a fire wall. This is being addressed by my architect and contractor to remove the regular outlets
Please specify the product. You have a number of very experienced folks on here that have yet to see such a product. If it is truly on your plans, it should be no issue to provide a reference to the product and its listing.
 
Please specify the product. You have a number of very experienced folks on here that have yet to see such a product. If it is truly on your plans, it should be no issue to provide a reference to the product and its listing.
I suspect it's an unsupported, untested claim on a product label and nothing more.
 
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