jar546
CBO
Can anyone gauge the value of the MCP? In my state I don't believe it has any value as long as you have all of the required certifications for your job. Is it marketing for a career or do some states or jurisdictions require it?
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MCP
- Thread starter jar546
- Start date
pyrguy
REGISTERED
Re: MCP
Jeff
I don't know of anyone that requires it.
Georgia only "requires" certification in what you inspect.
Louisiana requires certification but allows the CBO as a wild card.
I think that my MCP was a hindrance in my job search more than a help. It seems to have scared off some people. It did help at one AHJ I worked though. We had 4 MCP's back when there were less than 500 total.
Jeff
I don't know of anyone that requires it.
Georgia only "requires" certification in what you inspect.
Louisiana requires certification but allows the CBO as a wild card.
I think that my MCP was a hindrance in my job search more than a help. It seems to have scared off some people. It did help at one AHJ I worked though. We had 4 MCP's back when there were less than 500 total.
Re: MCP
Jeff,
I agree with Pryguy. It would depend on the position you are applying for. If you applied for a Building Inspector's job and the Building Official didn't have a CBO certification; I doubt he would want an MCP working for him. In most cases, over qualified is a bigger handicap than under qualified; especially in todays market; where municipalities are having to cut back.
When I applied for jobs; I only provided the qualifications (certs) that they asked for; and, maybe one more qualification above that requirement. Also, if you are over qualified, they worry about you leaving as soon as a better opportunity comes up.
When my father and I got our Master Plumber's License; we kept our Journeyman License active, in case we needed to get a job. People don't like hiring folks that are more qualified than themselves. Makes them nervous.
Uncle Bob
Jeff,
I agree with Pryguy. It would depend on the position you are applying for. If you applied for a Building Inspector's job and the Building Official didn't have a CBO certification; I doubt he would want an MCP working for him. In most cases, over qualified is a bigger handicap than under qualified; especially in todays market; where municipalities are having to cut back.
When I applied for jobs; I only provided the qualifications (certs) that they asked for; and, maybe one more qualification above that requirement. Also, if you are over qualified, they worry about you leaving as soon as a better opportunity comes up.
When my father and I got our Master Plumber's License; we kept our Journeyman License active, in case we needed to get a job. People don't like hiring folks that are more qualified than themselves. Makes them nervous.
Uncle Bob
RJJ
Co-Founder
Re: MCP
Jeff: it has no value in PA. It is not even worth the money spent to acquire it. However, among other code officials it does demonstrate a level of accomplishment. I have two to go for that award!
Spent most of this year debating if I was going to complete the certs. Now I have second thoughts on the subject. I guess if I proceed in that direction the only thing is a feeling of completion of a tasked I once started. The self satisfaction that I past all their tests.
To move beyond the title MCP I for one just keep learning everyday as much as I can. At the same time try to help those who have questions regarding codes etc. Even with the title education and learning must go on if we are to remain sharp and on top of the game. JMHO
Jeff: it has no value in PA. It is not even worth the money spent to acquire it. However, among other code officials it does demonstrate a level of accomplishment. I have two to go for that award!
Spent most of this year debating if I was going to complete the certs. Now I have second thoughts on the subject. I guess if I proceed in that direction the only thing is a feeling of completion of a tasked I once started. The self satisfaction that I past all their tests.
To move beyond the title MCP I for one just keep learning everyday as much as I can. At the same time try to help those who have questions regarding codes etc. Even with the title education and learning must go on if we are to remain sharp and on top of the game. JMHO
Bryan Holland
Silver Member
Re: MCP
Most jurisdictions here in Florida require their BO's to have the CBO certification, one or more plans examiner certifications, and one or more inspector certifications. In addition, they require a 4 year college education. However, the more certifications and licenses you have, the less important the college credit is. The MCP is one sure-fire way to obtain employment as a BO without having the college background. So, by the time you obtain all the certifications and licenses to move up the ranks on your way to BO, the MCP makes sense and is greatly desirable.
I am currently working on MCP. It keeps me in the books. It gives me both short-term and long-term professional goals. And, for every certification I obtain, the more credibility I seem to acquire as an instructor and code official.
Most jurisdictions here in Florida require their BO's to have the CBO certification, one or more plans examiner certifications, and one or more inspector certifications. In addition, they require a 4 year college education. However, the more certifications and licenses you have, the less important the college credit is. The MCP is one sure-fire way to obtain employment as a BO without having the college background. So, by the time you obtain all the certifications and licenses to move up the ranks on your way to BO, the MCP makes sense and is greatly desirable.
I am currently working on MCP. It keeps me in the books. It gives me both short-term and long-term professional goals. And, for every certification I obtain, the more credibility I seem to acquire as an instructor and code official.
incognito
Silver Member
Re: MCP
I heard it described as just more alphabet soup after your name and I tend to agree. They were able to find the correct answer while taking an open book test in an allocated amount of time. I have passed all I have taken the first time with plenty of time to spare. These were tests that I have seen others moaning about failing numerous times. I have lost interest in the certifications because they are to easy to obtain. They prove nothing. If passing them has a positive influence on what your employer pays you it may be beneficial, otherwise the certifications have minimal value.
I heard it described as just more alphabet soup after your name and I tend to agree. They were able to find the correct answer while taking an open book test in an allocated amount of time. I have passed all I have taken the first time with plenty of time to spare. These were tests that I have seen others moaning about failing numerous times. I have lost interest in the certifications because they are to easy to obtain. They prove nothing. If passing them has a positive influence on what your employer pays you it may be beneficial, otherwise the certifications have minimal value.
Bryan Holland
Silver Member
Re: MCP
I have also heard it said that the more intitials you place after your name, the less important you actually are. However, that doesn't alays hold true.
Regardless of how easy or not the certification exams are, they can and do make the difference when trying to get a job, keeping your job, and moving up in your job. If and only if they are obtained through REAL effort. My employer knows I am good at taken exams and they know I am book smart. But, they see the endless hours of study, research, and effort I put into learning new aspects of the industry and other codes and standards. The certifications allow them to justify raises, advancement, and other perks to management and my co-workers.
So while some may be able to say, "big deal, those exams are too easy." I can say, "it is a big deal, because I the certification is only a small component of the whole effort and I have the knowledge and training to back them up."
Five years from now, nobody is going to remember how hard the exam was or what it took to get the certification, they are just going to know that I have it and other don't. And its not going to get any easier getting them in the future.
I have also heard it said that the more intitials you place after your name, the less important you actually are. However, that doesn't alays hold true.
Regardless of how easy or not the certification exams are, they can and do make the difference when trying to get a job, keeping your job, and moving up in your job. If and only if they are obtained through REAL effort. My employer knows I am good at taken exams and they know I am book smart. But, they see the endless hours of study, research, and effort I put into learning new aspects of the industry and other codes and standards. The certifications allow them to justify raises, advancement, and other perks to management and my co-workers.
So while some may be able to say, "big deal, those exams are too easy." I can say, "it is a big deal, because I the certification is only a small component of the whole effort and I have the knowledge and training to back them up."
Five years from now, nobody is going to remember how hard the exam was or what it took to get the certification, they are just going to know that I have it and other don't. And its not going to get any easier getting them in the future.
georgia plans exam
Silver Member
Re: MCP
In the original post, jar546 asked; “Can anyone gauge the value of the MPC?”
Well, I don’t know if I can gauge the value of it to anyone else but, I can try to express what it means to me.
About four years ago, I set a goal for myself to attain the MPC certification. I already had attained the basic four certifications as an Inspector. I studied long and hard for each test because I knew that my jurisdiction would not pay for the exam unless I passed. That’s a pretty good incentive. I am blessed to have a family that understands how I get when I am focused on a goal. I know that some of the time I spent on my studies could have been spent on quality time with them and I appreciate their understanding.
In the process of studying for these exams, I learned a lot. I’ve heard many people express that passing an exam only means that you are a good tester. I disagree. I believe that passing an exam means that you were prepared for it. The only way to prepare for it is to hit the books. I have also heard it said that people forget everything they needed to know for a test soon after they pass it. I agree that some knowledge will fade but, if you use the codes everyday as I do, much of it is retained.
I received the MPC certification on July 14th, 2009. It felt pretty good! I had set a goal for myself and had achieved it. Not that that is the only goal in my life but, it was pretty cool.
I’ll tell you what felt even better though. At one of our monthly meetings of the North West Georgia Inspectors Association, I was presented with a Certificate of Recognition for meeting the requirements to obtain the MPC certification. To be recognized like that by my peers meant much more that the certificate itself.
So no, it doesn’t mean any more money or a promotion for me. It just means that I take my job seriously and am trying to be the best I can be in my chosen profession.
jmho---GPE
In the original post, jar546 asked; “Can anyone gauge the value of the MPC?”
Well, I don’t know if I can gauge the value of it to anyone else but, I can try to express what it means to me.
About four years ago, I set a goal for myself to attain the MPC certification. I already had attained the basic four certifications as an Inspector. I studied long and hard for each test because I knew that my jurisdiction would not pay for the exam unless I passed. That’s a pretty good incentive. I am blessed to have a family that understands how I get when I am focused on a goal. I know that some of the time I spent on my studies could have been spent on quality time with them and I appreciate their understanding.
In the process of studying for these exams, I learned a lot. I’ve heard many people express that passing an exam only means that you are a good tester. I disagree. I believe that passing an exam means that you were prepared for it. The only way to prepare for it is to hit the books. I have also heard it said that people forget everything they needed to know for a test soon after they pass it. I agree that some knowledge will fade but, if you use the codes everyday as I do, much of it is retained.
I received the MPC certification on July 14th, 2009. It felt pretty good! I had set a goal for myself and had achieved it. Not that that is the only goal in my life but, it was pretty cool.
I’ll tell you what felt even better though. At one of our monthly meetings of the North West Georgia Inspectors Association, I was presented with a Certificate of Recognition for meeting the requirements to obtain the MPC certification. To be recognized like that by my peers meant much more that the certificate itself.
So no, it doesn’t mean any more money or a promotion for me. It just means that I take my job seriously and am trying to be the best I can be in my chosen profession.
jmho---GPE
Re: MCP
This was the original question;
"Can anyone gauge the value of the MCP? In my state I don't believe it has any value as long as you have all of the required certifications for your job. Is it marketing for a career or do some states or jurisdictions require it?"
It can be a problem if you really "need" a job; and are over qualified.
However, as to the value of aquiring an MCP Certification; I have no doubt. I have busted my butt getting to within one certification of obtaining a CBO Certification; the hard way, by achieving all the commercial and residential certifications and passing the CBO Administrative Test.
There are people who are just plain good at taking and passing test; and I am happy for them. But, there is nothing easy about taking and passing all the Exams necessary to becoming an MCP. MCP is the most difficult Certification to obtain; and, when organizations government or private, seek the best of the best; this certification should be at the top of their list of desired qualifications.
I would be elated if MCP was an automatic guarantee of membership on ICC Boards.
Uncle Bob
This was the original question;
"Can anyone gauge the value of the MCP? In my state I don't believe it has any value as long as you have all of the required certifications for your job. Is it marketing for a career or do some states or jurisdictions require it?"
It can be a problem if you really "need" a job; and are over qualified.
However, as to the value of aquiring an MCP Certification; I have no doubt. I have busted my butt getting to within one certification of obtaining a CBO Certification; the hard way, by achieving all the commercial and residential certifications and passing the CBO Administrative Test.
There are people who are just plain good at taking and passing test; and I am happy for them. But, there is nothing easy about taking and passing all the Exams necessary to becoming an MCP. MCP is the most difficult Certification to obtain; and, when organizations government or private, seek the best of the best; this certification should be at the top of their list of desired qualifications.
I would be elated if MCP was an automatic guarantee of membership on ICC Boards.
Uncle Bob
Gene Boecker
REGISTERED
Re: MCP
Boy! Having been in this forum so long you all automatically know what MCP stands for.
My initial thought was "Why would anyone want to be a certified Male Chauvinist Pig?"
:lol:
Boy! Having been in this forum so long you all automatically know what MCP stands for.
My initial thought was "Why would anyone want to be a certified Male Chauvinist Pig?"
:lol:
incognito
Silver Member
Re: MCP
To those who think they have accomplished something worthwhile by being a certified MCP, I,m happy for you. I just do not see the value beyond possible pay increases. The feigned respect of others may get you off, but in the real world the "alphabet soup" after your name commands zero return. As I have told others, if you can't pass the ICC tests first time out you better go back to selling shoes.
To those who think they have accomplished something worthwhile by being a certified MCP, I,m happy for you. I just do not see the value beyond possible pay increases. The feigned respect of others may get you off, but in the real world the "alphabet soup" after your name commands zero return. As I have told others, if you can't pass the ICC tests first time out you better go back to selling shoes.
Re: MCP
It's important to me (because I was one of the first CEAP's in SBCCI).. not so much because I'm a good test taker (I'm not really).. but because I have the experience and knowledge of the Codes to back up the designation..
OK, I'm a code geek... there's not a whole lot more that I would rather do than increase my code knowledge.. it means I put on work boots, a hard hat and get into the field. I ask a lot of questions of other code professionals.. not because I can't trust my gut about an issue, but I value others' experience... and that's something that frequently lacks with most of us.
I've been offered jobs (including the one I currently have) because I'm an MCP... I've turned most of them down.. (not the right job, terms or time to switch).
It's a good notch in the belt to have; it means you are well rounded in Code knowledge. What we choose to do with it is up to us. There are a lot of MCP's (and PE's) out there who have never been in the field, and couldn't inspect their way out of a paper bag..
Likewise, there are a lot of non-MCP's who are the best all around inspectors I've ever seen!
Should we expect a better job because of it.. no.. we should be proud of our accomplishments (and we should be able to back it up).
JMHO.
It's important to me (because I was one of the first CEAP's in SBCCI).. not so much because I'm a good test taker (I'm not really).. but because I have the experience and knowledge of the Codes to back up the designation..
OK, I'm a code geek... there's not a whole lot more that I would rather do than increase my code knowledge.. it means I put on work boots, a hard hat and get into the field. I ask a lot of questions of other code professionals.. not because I can't trust my gut about an issue, but I value others' experience... and that's something that frequently lacks with most of us.
I've been offered jobs (including the one I currently have) because I'm an MCP... I've turned most of them down.. (not the right job, terms or time to switch).
It's a good notch in the belt to have; it means you are well rounded in Code knowledge. What we choose to do with it is up to us. There are a lot of MCP's (and PE's) out there who have never been in the field, and couldn't inspect their way out of a paper bag..
Likewise, there are a lot of non-MCP's who are the best all around inspectors I've ever seen!
Should we expect a better job because of it.. no.. we should be proud of our accomplishments (and we should be able to back it up).
JMHO.
Builder Bob
SAWHORSE
Re: MCP
My father had a Doctorate in Education. He told me on a regular basis - The title or level of education aren’t worth a cuss if you can't break it down to somebody's level."
The most educated people aren't necessarily the best communicators. The least educated people aren't necessarily the worst communicators.
Stop and think about that -
FWIW, I have the MCP and it hasn't gotten be a job yet ---- The ability to communicate and talk while in job interviews did.
My father had a Doctorate in Education. He told me on a regular basis - The title or level of education aren’t worth a cuss if you can't break it down to somebody's level."
The most educated people aren't necessarily the best communicators. The least educated people aren't necessarily the worst communicators.
Stop and think about that -
FWIW, I have the MCP and it hasn't gotten be a job yet ---- The ability to communicate and talk while in job interviews did.
packsaddle
Silver Member
- Joined
- Oct 17, 2009
- Messages
- 237
Re: MCP
The organization I work for has more MCPs working for them than any other organization on planet Earth.
For example, about half of the 50 MCPs in Texas work for us.
They pay us handsomely and, in return, exploit our credentials to acquire clients.
It has worked well in the private sector.
The organization I work for has more MCPs working for them than any other organization on planet Earth.
For example, about half of the 50 MCPs in Texas work for us.
They pay us handsomely and, in return, exploit our credentials to acquire clients.
It has worked well in the private sector.
Daddy-0-
REGISTERED
Re: MCP
We have two MCP's and neither one is the B.O. They could easily be a B.O. for many of our area counties but they like it where they are. I think it is great for us inspectors to be surrounded by knowledgeable people but the county does not seem to recognize the extra certs. I think that a feeling of personal accomplishment is all you can count on because most non code people don't understand or don't care.... But I do.
We have two MCP's and neither one is the B.O. They could easily be a B.O. for many of our area counties but they like it where they are. I think it is great for us inspectors to be surrounded by knowledgeable people but the county does not seem to recognize the extra certs. I think that a feeling of personal accomplishment is all you can count on because most non code people don't understand or don't care.... But I do.
Re: MCP
Jar: The value of any cert is what you value. That being said in PA the MCP allows a municipality to hire (1) person to do their code enforcement. L&I requires all code disiplines to be met by the municipality if they opt-in. My MCO (as it was originaly called) allowed me to start my
own 3rd party agency in PA...I am very happy with my career...Skip
Jar: The value of any cert is what you value. That being said in PA the MCP allows a municipality to hire (1) person to do their code enforcement. L&I requires all code disiplines to be met by the municipality if they opt-in. My MCO (as it was originaly called) allowed me to start my
own 3rd party agency in PA...I am very happy with my career...Skip
briankillebrew
Member
Speaking from someone who just recently accuired his MCP. I would say that the only reason i went as far and got my MCP was for personal achievement! Ive been in the industry a long time and am horrible with taking tests, but have always been good with the codes. When your faced with explaining the reasons for passing or failing an inspection to an Engineer they do take your explanations a little more seriously with the title behind your name. As far as employment i do agree that it can help and hinder a job offer, it just depends on if the company is looking for affordable or for the experience level. In my oppinion if you dont have the abuility to back up what you say you dont have
fatboy
Administrator
Welcome briankillabrew!
And good job on your MCP. I've got 4 more tests to go, but with tight budgets, don't see it in the neat future.
And good job on your MCP. I've got 4 more tests to go, but with tight budgets, don't see it in the neat future.
briankillebrew
Member
I lucked out and work for a company who pays for them as long as I pass them. Otherwise it would have taken me forever. And unfortunately you never feel like your finished! There is always more to learn. As a coworker has always touted "Just because your certified does not make you qualified". The day we stop learning new things is the day you need to hang up your hat. Thats the great thing about our field of work, codes and specifications change every day.
briankillebrew
Member
By the way fatboy I love the saying at the bottom of your posts!
I earned my MCP certification over 8 years ago. At the time, it was a personal goal as I was trying to prove to my employer I had what it took to move up within the organization. Now, it gets my foot in the door immediately for potential job interviews. To me, it says you get the intent behind the code. However, I've met some MCP's who quite frankly, don't get what the code means. So unfortunately some achieve it because they're good test takers while others take it to show their knowledge and passion for codes.
BSSTG
Gold Member
Greetings,
I don't know of any direct benefit to having MCP in Tx. However, I have always been amazed at how so many folks are swayed with titiles and such. I learned as a young feller from my dad (who negotiated contracts overseas on occasion) that having a title was always required. He said it stems back to European royalty. Everyone that was anyone was a king, prince, or what have you. So that's why when you go to your local bank everyone who is anyone is a vice president.
I'm not a MCP but have plenty of crap on my office wall. It always amazed me how some folks are really impressed by it all. I'm not.
BS
I don't know of any direct benefit to having MCP in Tx. However, I have always been amazed at how so many folks are swayed with titiles and such. I learned as a young feller from my dad (who negotiated contracts overseas on occasion) that having a title was always required. He said it stems back to European royalty. Everyone that was anyone was a king, prince, or what have you. So that's why when you go to your local bank everyone who is anyone is a vice president.
I'm not a MCP but have plenty of crap on my office wall. It always amazed me how some folks are really impressed by it all. I'm not.
BS