MODULAR HOMES v. FIRE

[FM William Burns]

FYI:

http://www.myfoxboston.com/dpp/news/und ... lt-to-burn

 

[TimNY]

Re: MODULAR HOMES v. FIRE

Precisely why I had insulation blown in the floor-ceiling space after my house was set.

Still, how does a discarded cigarette extend into the floor-ceiling space? Did they finish patching the holes in ceiling after it was set? Was the mating beam firestopped?

I can definitely see fire spreading rapidly when it gets into the ceiling-floor space (the GWB in mine was also glued with spray-foam type stuff). However, I am a bit skeptical as to how fire got into that space without having first activated a smoke alarm.

Tim

 

[Alias]

Re: MODULAR HOMES v. FIRE

FYI:http://www.myfoxboston.com/dpp/news/und ... lt-to-burn

Thanks for the link to the story. I haven't had one of these yet, but, who knows? One of the M/U dealers in OR has a two story on the lot and we get a lot that are bought in OR, hauled into CA, and installed. I will keep an eye out for the defects that were mentioned in the piece during installation.

Sue

 

[conarb]

Re: MODULAR HOMES v. FIRE

How is that adhesive foam different from the spray-in insulation foams in use today, or the sheet Styrofoams used on buildings? Also, our energy code requires the plates to be foamed as well as around the windows and doors, is that any different from this adhesive foam?

 

[bgingras]

Re: MODULAR HOMES v. FIRE

Precisely why I had insulation blown in the floor-ceiling space after my house was set.Still, how does a discarded cigarette extend into the floor-ceiling space? Did they finish patching the holes in ceiling after it was set? Was the mating beam firestopped?

I can definitely see fire spreading rapidly when it gets into the ceiling-floor space (the GWB in mine was also glued with spray-foam type stuff). However, I am a bit skeptical as to how fire got into that space without having first activated a smoke alarm.

Tim

The fire started outside in a window box with dry vegetation in it. I remember seeing reports of this fire and the cause discussed at a training he in MA. The cigarette ignited the window box, the fire spread up the wall of the farmers porch and into the ceiling. From there it found it's way through holes in the sheathing at the level between floors. The foam adhesive didn't take much to get going from there. The fire and smoke didn't make into into a space that had a detector for a little while. Basically the interior was surround by fire and smoke. in the cavities.

 

[peach]

Re: MODULAR HOMES v. FIRE

I've had headroom issues with Modular homes coming out of PA..

Having said that, the State is responsible to inspect the product... which includes fire blocking!

(Like at cove ceilings, bulkheads.. between floors, walls more than 10' high)... what in the world are the state inspectors looking at, exactly?

It's a residential building code issue.. not fire code... and it's pretty dang basic

 

[bgingras]

Re: MODULAR HOMES v. FIRE

I've had headroom issues with Modular homes coming out of PA..Having said that, the State is responsible to inspect the product... which includes fire blocking!

(Like at cove ceilings, bulkheads.. between floors, walls more than 10' high)... what in the world are the state inspectors looking at, exactly?

It's a residential building code issue.. not fire code... and it's pretty dang basic

We got all kinds of grief inspecting modular home here. There isn't much inspecting of them when they come in. We are told it's an engineered product repeatedly. Anytime we find an issue it seems we immediately get an engineer stamping it as still being good. Missing steel plates, hangers etc "no problem here is the stamped modified plans". We requested to be on site when boxes arrive, and are lucky if we even get a call when they do or even after they set them. The last one I looked at we drove by every couple hours to see they had come in. We heard they were when the police notified us that they were spotted and stuck at a corner. We arrived the next morning when we knew they would be setting them to find all of the boxes had structural damage from the drive in, and they were trying to place them "as-is". We stopped them and made them replace joists and other broken components. The way these units come in, we cannot see half of what we should really be looking at. The state inspectors here don't look at them, it's up to us to keep reporting problems until the state revokes the certification. Half the time we get plans for a modular, and it's not the same home that arrives. Usually the units don't comply with smoke and CO placement, they don't interconnect, or other issues. Hopefully things change here, but right now the "engineered product" thing ties our hands on a lot of stuff, at least it did in my last town where I was the assistant.

 

[conarb]

Re: MODULAR HOMES v. FIREMarshal Burns and other fire service people:These flammable toxic foam products have spread to conventional construction, both as board exterior insulation and as blown-in spray insulation, from the video linked above.foamfire2.jpg[/attachment:3vtn14rt]foamfire1.jpg[/attachment:3vtn14rt]Why don't you guys use the money and muscle you showed in getting sprinklers mandated to getting theses products banned? You'd even have the environmental nuts behind you, they want them banned becasue of the Pacific Gyre twice the size of Texas and the environmental threats they pose.

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[Builder Bob]

Re: MODULAR HOMES v. FIRE

modular homes are (self) inspected by a third party and signed off. The only authority the local AHJ has in our state is foundation, anchorage and steps to door (power connection to utuilities- bonding of chasis, water - point of connection, and point of sewer connection.

 

[conarb]

Re: MODULAR HOMES v. FIRE

Bob:

My point is that many of these toxic foams are one being used in stick built homes, even expensice ones with these energy efficiency requirements.

 

[JBI]

Re: MODULAR HOMES v. FIRE

I think I want one of those 'third-party-inspector' jobs. All the money and none of the responsibility? Sounds like a Congressional job! :lol:

We in NYS are similarly hampered by the rules that we only inspect what is done 'on-site'.

 

[FM William Burns]

Re: MODULAR HOMES v. FIRE

ConArb,

You know where I stand with that question (my historic stance and postings on relative matter). I'm doing my part in the educational process even amongst our own people including the IAFF and IAFC since as you know, I do not believe sprinklers are the cure all (but do support) especially when they don't get adopted.

I can't speak for other fire service people but I'm the Maverick as a former state fire marshal from CA called me in Baltimore when I replied that the only special interest I serve is the general public.

 

[TimNY]

Re: MODULAR HOMES v. FIRE

Seems like that fire was cooking for a while. I wonder if the strip of sheathing was applied per the set instructions to tie the 2nd floor box to the 1st floor box.

I know when my boxes were mated the rim joists from the 2nd floor box were pretty tight with the rim around the ceiling joists on the 1st floor boxes. Put sheathing over that and it is as tight as any other joint on a house imho. The problem is most of these set crews don't follow the set instructions and the boxes don't mate properly.

I believe there is a secondary element to this problem other than the foam. In my opinion, the problem is inadequate draftstopping. Draftstop concealed spaces over 1000 square feet? Once a fire gets into that cavity there is no requirement to prevent it from spreading throughout the entire space between floors.

@peach- I have one right now where they have a headroom problem at the stairs.

 

[conarb]

Re: MODULAR HOMES v. FIRE

It appears that we are going to be seeing more of these things.