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Open Staircases

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PaulAtkinson

Registered User
Joined
Oct 6, 2021
Messages
2
Location
Riyadh
We have a unique situation on a part completed building that has not yet been approved by Civil Defence Fire authority here. The building is approx 141meters high over 37 floors and is residential occupancy. The main building is served by two staircases of correct width. The staircases are internal staircases from ground to level 4, then are fully open externally (though sheltered) to one side for the remaining floors to Level 37. We are being told that we need to enclose and install a pressurisation system. This appears against common sense to enclose a stair that is fully open to the free air on one complete side.

Does anyone know how the designers intended this to work as they are no longer contactable and our current fire engineers are not familiar with any permitting code for this arrangement?

many thanks in advance

Paul
 
Couple of questions: what is your role in this? What code was in place when the permit was issued? Why are the designers no longer involved?

I cannot imagine an open-air stairwell 30+ floors up. Unless the handrail is high enough that i could not see over the top.
 
JPohling said:
got my popcorn..................how do occupants exit during a sand storm?
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Has been my thoughts exactly,

My basic understanding of egress stair towers is that they are their own contained environment allowing for egress in an emergency that is absent the issues going on inside or outside the building they serve.

Thus, floors 1-4 seem to abide by that design, but the other 33 floors are open to the elements, though they might be a good non-M.O.E. sight to see, how do they protect those existing from the building if the weather outside is not a perfect clam day, 75 degrees, and shady?

The OP notes open but sheltered, not sure how that works anyhow

I have been waiting for those more qualified than I to chirp in, but the popcorn got me hungry, to comment with a question or two.
 
All,
thanks for you responses, our role is as site supervision for the contractors charged with making the buildings occupiable. Designers are no longer involved as they were employed over 10 years ago in a Design and Build Arrangement. At the time of design IBC code would have been 2008 version.
The requirement for shelter is valid, sandstorms apart, it rains twice a year. As to the issue of height and phobia, I cannot find specific reference to this in code, but understand the concerns.

As to the popcorn, bon appetite!
 
PaulAtkinson said:
All,
thanks for you responses, our role is as site supervision for the contractors charged with making the buildings occupiable. Designers are no longer involved as they were employed over 10 years ago in a Design and Build Arrangement. At the time of design IBC code would have been 2008 version.
The requirement for shelter is valid, sandstorms apart, it rains twice a year. As to the issue of height and phobia, I cannot find specific reference to this in code, but understand the concerns.

As to the popcorn, bon appetite!
Click to expand...
Though the code does not address height and phobia directly, the exiting stair towers are for an emergency to get everyone out of the building, in reality not everyday use. Think of a normal building use, everyone comes in and uses the elevators more than likely, except for maybe the occasional fitness geek.

But in reality, they will never be used much until an emergency, thus they are designed to be their own environment, not to be influenced by any elements inside or outside the building until you are ground level and exiting.

The reason for the emergency could be something happening outside the building on a non-perfect day or could be man/woman made, and thus now how does that help the 33 floors above. Not to mention your point of someone freezing in place because of a height issue.

Hence the closed environment of the stair tower.
 
Another purpose is to reduce visual and audio stimuli in an emergency. This helps minimize distractions, which maximizes occupant exiting speed.

While these are not code requirements, they are none the less concepts that responsible designers typically take into account in their design. People can be found negligent for more than just not meeting the code after all.
 
e hilton said:
So is this the first time occupants are trying to move in? Why the questions now?

That was more of a personal comment, wasn't intended to be about code compliance.
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What is being provided to prevent jumpers or are the open sides screened?
I just saw a 13 story building in North Hollywood with exposed stairs.
 
I think your going to have a serious issue. Check your IBC 1026.2. will not allow exterior exit stairs for a building 6 stories above grade plane or 75' above the lowest level of fire department access.
 
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