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Pool Hardware

LGreene

LGreene

REGISTERED
Joined
Oct 20, 2009
Messages
1,165
Location
San Miguel de Allende, Mexico
I recently saw a pool door in a hotel that had a panic device mounted abnormally high. Someone else just asked me a question about hardware on an indoor pool, so I checked the 2009 IBC. I see where it talks about the gate latch being 48"-54" AFF, but in 3109.4.2 it says that walls surrounding indoor swimming pools do not have to comply with Section 3109.4.1.8.

Am I missing something? Do indoor pools need latching hardware mounted between 48" and 54" or are some people misinterpreting the requirements?
 
2010 CALIFORNIA BUILDING CODE

3118B.2 Gates.

Hand-activated door- or gate-opening hardware shall be located at least 3.5 feet above the deck or walkway
 
2006 INTERNATIONAL BUILDING CODE@

3109.4.1.7 Gates. Access gates shall comply with the

requirements of Sections 3109.4.1.1 through 3109.4.1.6

and shall be equipped to accommodate a locking device.

Pedestrian access gates shall open outward away from

the pool and shall be self-closing and have a self-latching

device. Gates other than pedestrian access gates shall

have a self-latching device. Release mechanisms shall be

in accordance with Sections 1008.1.8 and 1109.13.

Where the release mechanism of the self-latching device

is located less than 54 inches (1372 mm) from the bottom

ofthe gate, the release inechanism shall be located on the

pool side of the gate at least 3 inches (76 mm) below the

top of the gate, and the gate and barrier shall have no

opening greater than 0.5 inch (12.7 mm) within 18 inches

(457 mm) of the release mechanism..
 
International Building Code 2012

3109.3 Public swimming pools.

Public swimming pools shall be completely enclosed by a fence not less than 4 feet (1290 mm) in height or a screen enclosure. Openings in the fence shall not permit the passage of a 4-inch-diameter (102 mm) sphere. The fence or screen enclosure shall be equipped with self-closing and self-latching gates.
 
3109.4 is residential pools.........that might be the glitch or gray area....it talks about dwelling walls.....then you can just have the alarms located at 54".....Quick answer, see if that helps...

LGreene said:
I recently saw a pool door in a hotel that had a panic device mounted abnormally high. Someone else just asked me a question about hardware on an indoor pool, so I checked the 2009 IBC. I see where it talks about the gate latch being 48"-54" AFF, but in 3109.4.2 it says that walls surrounding indoor swimming pools do not have to comply with Section 3109.4.1.8.Am I missing something? Do indoor pools need latching hardware mounted between 48" and 54" or are some people misinterpreting the requirements?
Click to expand...
 
In pool rooms and pool maintanence rooms we see corrosion on sprinkler heads and smoke detectors and heat detectors. Do you also see corrosion on door hardware and if so, how do you meet the challange?
 
I'm sure you might, here is how we would deal with it;

1030.2 Reliability. Required exit accesses, exits or exit discharges shall be continuously maintained free from obstructions or impediments to full instant use in the case of fire or other emergency when the areas served by such exits are occupied. Security devices affecting means of egress shall be subject to approval of the fire code official.
 
LARMGUY said:
I would say special maintenance and stainless steel hardware.Then there is this:

http://www.bssa.org.uk/cms/File/Baddoo%20Swimming%20Pools%20(3p).pdf
Click to expand...
I agree - stainless steel hardware, and special rust inhibitor on closers. I have a bunch of photos of rusty pool hardware...I'll have to do a blog post once I get the mounting height answer completely worked out. That's a great article - thanks!
 
mark handler said:
International Building Code 2012 3109.3 Public swimming pools.

Public swimming pools shall be completely enclosed by a fence not less than 4 feet (1290 mm) in height or a screen enclosure. Openings in the fence shall not permit the passage of a 4-inch-diameter (102 mm) sphere. The fence or screen enclosure shall be equipped with self-closing and self-latching gates.
Click to expand...
Thanks Mark. I have pasted the whole swimming pool section below so we can discuss. This is from the 2012 IBC but there were no changes from the 2009 IBC.

A few things...

a) 3109.3 is a short paragraph relative to public swimming pools. It does not define the mounting height for the hardware, and it goes into very little detail about the enclosure.

b) 3109.4 is relative to residential swimming pools. It goes into great detail about the fence and gate, including the requirement for a self-closing and self-latching door/gate. Shouldn't this information apply to public swimming pools too? When the dwelling wall is used as part of the pool barrier, there are requirements for the doors leading to the pool, including an alarm. There is another paragraph which exempts indoor pools from these requirements, but we're still talking about residential pools.

c) The pools I'm asking about are hotel pools, the pool at the YMCA, a pool at a high school, etc. Do any of these requirements apply to those pools? Our YMCA has locker rooms opening directly to the pool with no latch. That seems fine per the IBC, but I want to make sure I'm not missing something before I attempt to help the person who asked the original question.

SECTION 3109

SWIMMING POOL ENCLOSURES AND SAFETY DEVICES

3109.1 General. Swimming pools shall comply with the

requirements of Sections 3109.2 through 3109.5 and other

applicable sections of this code.

3109.2 Definition. The following term is defined in Chapter

2:

SWIMMING POOLS.

3109.3 Public swimming pools. Public swimming pools shall be completely enclosed by a fence not less than 4 feet (1290 mm) in height or a screen enclosure. Openings in the fence shall not permit the passage of a 4-inch-diameter (102 mm) sphere. The fence or screen enclosure shall be equipped with self-closing and self-latching gates.

3109.4 Residential swimming pools. Residential swimming pools shall comply with Sections 3109.4.1 through 3109.4.3.

Exception: A swimming pool with a power safety cover or a spa with a safety cover complying with ASTM F 1346 need not comply with Section 3109.4.

3109.4.1 Barrier height and clearances. The top of the barrier shall be not less than 48 inches (1219 mm) above grade measured on the side of the barrier that faces away from the swimming pool. The vertical clearance between grade and the bottom of the barrier shall be not greater than 2 inches (51 mm) measured on the side of the barrier that faces away from the swimming pool. Where the top of the pool structure is above grade, the barrier is authorized to be at ground level or mounted on top of the pool structure, and the vertical clearance between the top of the pool structure and the bottom of the barrier shall be not greater than 4 inches (102 mm).

3109.4.1.1 Openings. Openings in the barrier shall not allow passage of a 4-inch-diameter (102 mm) sphere.

3109.4.1.2 Solid barrier surfaces. Solid barriers which do not have openings shall not contain indentations or protrusions except for normal construction tolerances and tooled masonry joints.

3109.4.1.3 Closely spaced horizontal members. Where the barrier is composed of horizontal and vertical members and the distance between the tops of the horizontal members is less than 45 inches (1143 mm), the horizontal members shall be located on the swimming pool side of the fence. Spacing between vertical members shall be not greater than 13/4 inches (44 mm) in width. Where there are decorative cutouts within vertical members, spacing within the cutouts shall be not greater than 13/4 inches (44 mm) in width.

3109.4.1.4 Widely spaced horizontal members. Where the barrier is composed of horizontal and vertical members and the distance between the tops of the horizontal members is 45 inches (1143 mm) or more, spacing between vertical members shall be not greater than 4 inches (102 mm). Where there are decorative cutouts within vertical members, spacing within the cutouts shall be not greater than 13/4 inches (44 mm) in width.

3109.4.1.5 Chain link dimensions. Mesh size for chain link fences shall be not greater than a 21/4 inch square (57 mm square) unless the fence is provided with slats fastened at the top or the bottom which reduce the openings to not more than 13/4 inches (44 mm).

3109.4.1.6 Diagonal members. Where the barrier is composed of diagonal members, the opening formed by the diagonal members shall be not greater than 13/4 inches (44 mm).

3109.4.1.7 Gates. Access doors or gates shall comply with the requirements of Sections 3109.4.1.1 through 3109.4.1.6 and shall be equipped to accommodate a locking device. Pedestrian access doors or gates shall open outward away from the pool and shall be selfclosing and have a self-latching device. Doors or gates other than pedestrian access doors or gates shall have a self-latching device. Release mechanisms shall be in accordance with Sections 1008.1.9 and 1109.13. Where the release mechanism of the self-latching device is located less than 54 inches (1372 mm) from the bottom of the door or gate, the release mechanism shall be located on the pool side of the door or gate 3 inches (76 mm) or more, below the top of the door or gate, and the door or gate and barrier shall be without openings greater than 1/2 inch (12.7 mm) within 18 inches (457 mm) of the release mechanism.

3109.4.1.8 Dwelling wall as a barrier. Where a wall of a dwelling serves as part of the barrier, one of the following shall apply:

1. Doors with direct access to the pool through that wall shall be equipped with an alarm that produces an audible warning when the door and/or its screen, if present, are opened. The alarm shall be listed and labeled in accordance with UL 2017. In dwellings not required to be Accessible units, Type A units or Type B units, the deactivation switch shall be located 54 inches (1372 mm) or more above the threshold of the door. In dwellings required to be Accessible units, Type A units or Type B units, the deactivation switch shall be located not higher than 54 inches (1372 mm) and not less than 48 inches (1219 mm) above the threshold of the door.

2. The pool shall be equipped with a power safety cover that complies with ASTM F 1346.

3. Other means of protection, such as self-closing doors with self-latching devices, which are approved, shall be accepted so long as the degree of protection afforded is not less than the protection afforded by Section 3109.4.1.8, Item 1 or 2.

3109.4.1.9 Pool structure as barrier. Where an aboveground pool structure is used as a barrier or where the barrier is mounted on top of the pool structure, and the means of access is a ladder or steps, then the ladder or steps either shall be capable of being secured, locked or removed to prevent access, or the ladder or steps shall be surrounded by a barrier which meets the requirements of Sections 3109.4.1.1 through 3109.4.1.8. Where the ladder or steps are secured, locked or removed, any opening created shall not allow the passage of a 4-inch-diameter (102 mm) sphere.

3109.4.2 Indoor swimming pools. Walls surrounding indoor swimming pools shall not be required to comply with Section 3109.4.1.8.

3109.4.3 Prohibited locations. Barriers shall be located so as to prohibit permanent structures, equipment or similar objects from being used to climb the barriers.

3109.5 Entrapment avoidance. Suction outlets shall be designed and installed in accordance with ANSI/APSP-7.
 
LGreene said:
I recently saw a pool door in a hotel that had a panic device mounted abnormally high. Someone else just asked me a question about hardware on an indoor pool, so I checked the 2009 IBC. I see where it talks about the gate latch being 48"-54" AFF, but in 3109.4.2 it says that walls surrounding indoor swimming pools do not have to comply with Section 3109.4.1.8.Am I missing something? Do indoor pools need latching hardware mounted between 48" and 54" or are some people misinterpreting the requirements?
Click to expand...
I would say the hardware had to comply with normal building codes in observance of ADA regulations. How high is abnormally high?
 
LARMGUY said:
I would say the hardware had to comply with normal building codes in observance of ADA regulations. How high is abnormally high?
Click to expand...
I didn't measure that particular door, but I have had several people tell me that they had to mount hardware on pool doors at 54" AFF, or above 48" AFF. I'm looking for something to support that, or preferably something to show that it is not required for indoor pools.
 
I found some more information on this while researching an article on hardware mounting heights (sounds like a good read, no? :-) ).

IBC 2009 1109.12:

7. Access doors or gates in barrier walls and fences protecting pools, spas and hot tubs shall be permitted to have operable parts of the release of latch on self-latching devices at 54 inches (1370 mm) maximum and 48 inches minimum above the finished floor or ground, provided the self-latching devices are not also self-locking devices, operated by means of a key, electronic opener, or integral combination lock.

International Residential Code, Appendix G -AG105.3 Indoor swimming pool. All walls surrounding an indoor swimming pool shall comply with Section AG105.2, item 9.

Commentary: Indoor pools represent the same hazards as outdoor pools. For this reason, the walls and doors surrounding an indoor swimming pool are regulated in the same manner as an exterior wall of a dwelling where the wall is used as a barrier for an outdoor pool. The provisions of Section AG105.2, Item 9 apply in their entirety.

AG105.2, Item 9:

9. Where a wall of a dwelling serves as part of the barrier one of the following conditions shall be met:

9.1. The pool shall be equipped with a powered safety cover in compliance with ASTM F1346; or

9.2. All doors with direct access to the pool through that wall shall be equipped with an alarm which produces an audible warning when the door and its screen, if present, are opened. The alarm shall sound continuously for a minimum of 30 seconds immediately after the door is opened and be capable of being heard throughout the house during normal household activities. The alarm shall automatically reset under all conditions. The alarm system shall be equipped with a manual means, such as touchpad or switch, to temporarily deactivate the alarm for a single opening. Such deactivation shall last for not more than 15 seconds. The deactivation switch(es) shall be located at least 54 inches (1372 mm) above the threshold of the door; or

9.3. Other means of protection, such as self-closing doors with self-latching devices, which are approved by the governing body, shall be acceptable so long as the degree of protection afforded is not less than the protection afforded by Item 9.1 or 9.2 described above.

My original question was related to indoor pools in hotels and health clubs. Does the paragraph above from the IBC mean that the hardware would have to be self-latching and mounted between 48" and 54" AFF even though section 3109 is pretty vague on indoor pools?

Also, the IBC has an exception pertaining to pools in the mounting height section: Exception: Access doors or gates in barrier walls and fences protecting pools, spas and hot tubs shall be permitted to have operable parts of the release of latch on self-latching devices at 54 inches (1370 mm) maximum above the finished floor or ground, provided the self-latching devices are not also self-locking devices operated by means of a key, electronic opener or integral combination lock.



Does the prohibition on self-locking devices operated by means of a key, electronic opening, or integral combination lock mean that you can't have those devices on the egress side? Or either side? I would think the egress side but I'm not 100% sure based on the language.
 
3109.4 Residential swimming pools. Residential swimming pools shall comply with Sections 3109.4.1 through 3109.4.3
Click to expand...
3109.4.1 thru 3109.4.3 does not apply to public swimming pools

IBC 2009 1109.12:

7.

is the answer to your question
 
mtlogcabin said:
3109.4.1 thru 3109.4.3 does not apply to public swimming poolsIBC 2009 1109.12:

7. is the answer to your question
Click to expand...
It says the latch shall be permitted to be between 48" and 54". Is it ok to have no latch at all for an indoor public pool in a commercial facility? Or a latch that's lower than 48"?
 
Is it ok to have no latch at all for an indoor public pool in a commercial facility? Or a latch that's lower than 48"?
Click to expand...
I do not find a code requirement specifically requiring a latch on the door but logic would say it you are required to have a barrier then a latching door would need to be part of the barrier.
 
LGreene said:
Is it OK to have no latch at all for an indoor public pool in a commercial facility?
Click to expand...
If so, I believe you have found a hole that needs to be addressed. It sounds as if when they were writing the code someone said, "What about indoor pools?", then they wrote this.

3109.4.2 Indoor swimming pools. Walls surrounding indoor swimming pools shall not be required to comply with Section 3109.4.1.8.
Click to expand...
In my opinion, the above was to avoid the issue completely hoping it would be addressed by 1109: 12.
 
LARMGUY said:
I would say special maintenance and stainless steel hardware.Then there is this:

http://www.bssa.org.uk/cms/File/Baddoo%20Swimming%20Pools%20(3p).pdf
Click to expand...
First remember that chrome doesn't work. But the type stainless being used also needs to be considered. 304 stainless doesn't do it. It needs to be 316. All of the ladders and fixtures from the swiming pool equipment manuf. are 316. But hardware doesn't come in 316. Apparently it is too hard to machine. And it's more expensive. Another option is nickel plated. Nickel is one of the elements that makes stainless stainless. When was the last time you saw a rusty nickel? But everyone needs to remember that the chlorine fume (gas) environment in a pool is one of the nastier environments found in buildings. Frequent maintainance and early replacement are to be expected.
 
When I think of the YMCA and similar places these are monitored facilities. You don't have a gate to go through to access the pool but you have to sign in at the front desk and they usually have another attendant where you sign in again near the pool and of course lifeguards everywhere.

Hotels are similar because it usually takes a key card to get into the pool enclosure.

These types of facilities have fences or other means to keep the general public away from the pool. You must access through the building.
 
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