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Roof attachment to Brick

RJJ said:
Would you allow a roof to be attached to a brick veneer on wood frame. This is for an A-2 oc ? I would say no! I need chapter and verse.
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I would cite, manufacturer approved details and BIA. Sometimes looking outside the code gets you where you need to go.

When you mean roofing, are you talking flashing or roofing
 
If the structural engineer approved it maybe......I know there is an IRC section that talks of veneers not supporting anything but themselves.....can't find such a section in the IBC......Maybe 2104
 
Properly the attachment of veneers would be addressed in the construction documents.

IBC Section 1405 addresses the attachment of veneers. The structural provisions define the forces used when designing the members that the veneer is attached to.
 
well I have sent the question back to the DP"s.

Now my first question is how many wall ties have been used in the veneer section when it was constructed?

How did you come up with the Conclusion from the above?

How was it fasten to the wood 2x6's behind?

Did they use roofing nails? / How long?

Did they use 2 nails per tie or 1?

Please show me your numbers for the lateral resistance of that brick veneer?
 
Builder Bob said:
NO - Veneer is just that (cosmetic)- it is not a structurural component..........
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Depends on the brick veneer system that will be used.
 
By definition, it doesn't. Veneers are always non-structural. As are curtain walls. That means nothing may bear upon them. It does not mean that items cannot be attached to them in a non-structural manner.
 
RJJ (and others),

Like RJJ, I too have an existing restaurant (an A-2) that

wants to change out their existing canvas awning canopies

and install new, PT wooden rafters with a metal roofing system

on them. The RDP is showing wood ledger strips in the upper

& mid height locations for the points of bearing of the roofing

rafters & bracing. These ledger strips will attach to the existing

brick veneer, however, the RDP does not indicate how these

ledger strips will be attached, only that they are there (on the

plans).

I know that the wall has adequate masonry wall ties behind

the brick veneer, because I inspected this restaurant when it

was being built.

QUESTION # 1: What section from the IBC, addresses

attachment to the masonry veneers?

QUESTION # 2: Can a ledger strip be attached to the veneer

using something akin to a wall anchor ( metal, plastic, other)

installed in the mortar joints, or does the point of attachment

have to be installed in to the structural components behind

the veneer?

We are using the 2006 IBC.

Thanks for any input! :)

.
 
ICE said:
Brick veneer is a vertical rubble pile.
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We know that.....but where is the code section?

Here is something I could hang my hat on in the IRC:

R703.7.3 Lintels.

Masonry veneer shall not support any vertical load other than the dead load of the veneer above.

I have not found a comparable IBC section....I have not really looked in depth yet, and I would be very hesitant to approve it, but with engineering it might be approvable....
 
How thick is it?

2109.5.2 Minimum thickness.

The minimum thickness of masonry bearing walls more than one story high shall be 8 inches (203 mm). Bearing walls of one-story buildings shall not be less than 6 inches (152 mm) thick.
 
GT...part of the problem with attaching to the ledger is that by the time you get the "bolts" tight you will also crush the veneer in....IF an engineer insisted on using a design like this, I would require very specific design and probably special inspection and signoff that it was installed exactly as they designed....
 
steveray,

Thanks for the input!

My application is not a "bearing wall", but only a veneered

application. An RDP has designed the PT wood ledger strips

for the attachment & bearing points.

Since I too cannot locate an IBC section, I will assume that

since an RDP has "designed" these plans, if they want to use

silly putty to attach the ledger strips, then I would have to

approve it, and let any liability issues rest on them, rather

than my AHJ.

Thoughts..

.
 
Then I would check if he/she is working outside of their license or ability with the state.......If they are hanging a roof off of it, it is a bearing wall now.....

globe trekker said:
steveray,Not an engineer, but an architect in this area.

.
Click to expand...
 
..maybe Section 1609 - Wind Loads is where I should be looking for the

restraint required to resist detachment of the ledger strips from the

veneered masonry. Section 1609.1. directs the reader to Ch. 6 of

ASCE 7 for determination of wind loads.

.
 
This RDP has designed the installation of Simpson-Strongtie H2P5

straps (48" o.c.) where the roof rafters attach to the header at

the lower end, so he is aware of the wind loading. Just nothing

yet on the upper points-of-attachment for the ledger strips.

.
 
"
quote_icon.png
Originally Posted by ICE Brick veneer is a vertical rubble pile."

"Until you attempt to place structural loads upon it.

Then it becomes a horizontal rubble pile..."

I agree with both of these replies.....
 
Brudgers already handled this one, it's the definition. Never forget chapter two...or where it references you to.

Section 1402, "Veneer. A facing attached to a wall for the purpose of providing ornamentation, protection or insulation, but not counted as adding strength to the wall."

That is a code section that should certainly support your hat.

Case Closed.
 
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