Sprinkler pipe gauge?

[mtlogcabin]

2009 IBC 2007 NFPA standards

What are the pros and cons of 7 gauge grooved pipe versus 10 gauge grooved pipe.

Just had a sprinkler designer call out 7 gauge on a drawing. Should there be a concern?

Seismic zone D, We see a lot of antifreeze systems

Just trying to stay abreast of changes and potential problems

 

[cda]

Wet or dry system??

Is the a brand or system associated with the pipe??

Not near the books till Monday, normally see scheduled pipe

 

[cda]

Found this for now

check page 10

https://www.fmglobal.com/assets/pdf/fmapprovals/1630.pdf

7 gauge is maybe .18 inches????? Not sure

 

[cda]

This is 1994:::

https://www.fmglobal.com/assets/pdf/fmapprovals/1630.pdf

 

[cda]

http://www.usfa.fema.gov/downloads/pdf/coffee-break/cb_fp_2014_6.pdf

 

[Msradell]

I think that NFPA requires a minimum of 10gauge for rolled groove piping and a minimum of schedule 40 (possibly 30) for threaded piping. Don't have the information currently available to me now however.

 

[cda]

still not near the books

not sure if this is the answer::

6.3.2* Steel Pipe—Welded or Roll-Grooved. When steel pipe referenced in Table 6.3.1.1 is used and joined by welding as

referenced in 6.5.2 or by roll-grooved pipe and fittings as referenced in 6.5.3, the minimum nominal wall thickness for pressures up to

300 psi (20.7 bar) shall be in accordance with Schedule 10 for pipe sizes up to 5 in. (125 mm), 0.134 in. (3.40 mm) for 6 in. (150 mm)

pipe, 0.188 in. (4.78 mm) for 8 in. and 10 in. (200 mm and 250 mm) pipe, and 0.330 in. (8.38 mm) for 12 in. (300 mm) pipe.

http://www.nfpa.org/Assets/files/AboutTheCodes/13/TIA13-13-2.pdf

 

[fireguy]

http://www.engineersedge.com/pipe_schedules.htm

We see 5 and 10 used for dry systems. We have seen those pipes rust through in 10 or 12 years. Schedule 5 and 10 meet code, but are a poor choice based upon time to rust through. We install 40 on our repairs.

 

[cda]

http://www.engineersedge.com/pipe_schedules.htm We see 5 and 10 used for dry systems. We have seen those pipes rust through in 10 or 12 years. Schedule 5 and 10 meet code, but are a poor choice based upon time to rust through. We install 40 on our repairs.

So what does 7 gauge equate to?

 

[Msradell]

7gauge flat stock is 0.1793" however normally pipe is specified as scheduled ## not as a gauge.

 

[FM William Burns]

I would question the sprinkler designer's use of the term "gauge" versus the term "schedule" and is he/she intending on using pipe or tube. Sprinkler piping is determined for compliant use by the term schedule and has to do with the interior wall thickness. This determines the amounts of pressure the pipe can handle. Tubing is measured by exterior thickness and is of a different style (CPVC Brass etc.) versus steel/back pipe, NFPA 13 Chapter 6.3 will tell you what they can use.

 

[Frank]

There have been a number of sub schedule 10 sprinkler pipes listed some with the use of pressfit or other proprietary joining methods. Some like Poz Lok have gone down in leaks and a flood of lawsuits.

They typically claim to use superior strength steel and per some corrosion test near equivalence to black schedule 40 pipe. They also claim lower costs, better flow characteristics and lighter pipe is easier to ship and install. I have seen many come and go over the years.

 

[cda]

does this also cover the question:::

2007 edition::

6.3.2* Steel Pipe — Welded or Roll-Grooved. When steel pipe referenced in Table 6.3.1.1 is used and joined by welding as referenced in 6.5.2 or by roll-grooved pipe and fittings as referenced in 6.5.3, the minimum nominal wall thickness for pressures up to 300 psi (20.7 bar) shall be in accordance with Schedule 10 for pipe sizes up to 5 in. (125 mm), 0.134 in. (3.40 mm) for 6 in. (150 mm) pipe, 0.188 in. (4.78 mm) for 8 and 10 in. (200 and 250 mm) pipe, and 0.330 in. (8.38 mm) for 12 in. (300 mm) pipe.

nfpa 13 2013

6.3.2* Steel Pipe — Welded or Roll-Grooved. When steel pipe referenced in Table 6.3.1.1 is used and joined by welding as referenced in 6.5.2 or by roll-grooved pipe and fittings as referenced in 6.5.3, the minimum nominal wall thickness for pressures up to 300 psi (20.7 bar) shall be in accordance with Schedule 10 for pipe sizes up to 5 in. (125 mm), 0.134 in. (3.40 mm) for 6 in. (150 mm) pipe, 0.188 in. (4.78 mm) for 8 in. and 10 in. (200 mm and 250 mm) pipe, and 0.330 in. (8.38 mm) for 12 in. (300 mm) pipe.

2010 edtion::

6.3.2* Steel Pipe — Welded or Roll-Grooved. When steel pipe referenced in Table 6.3.1.1 is used and joined by welding as referenced in 6.5.2 or by roll-grooved pipe and fittings as referenced in 6.5.3, the minimum nominal wall thickness for pressures up to 300 psi (20.7 bar) shall be in accordance with Schedule 10 for pipe sizes up to 5 in. (125 mm), 0.134 in. (3.40 mm) for 6 in. (150 mm) pipe, 0.188 in. (4.78 mm) for 8 in. and 10 in. (200 mm and 250 mm) pipe, and 0.330 in. (8.38 mm) for 12 in. (300 mm) pipe.

 

[Frank]

CDA They get around that by 6.3.4 and 6.3.6 for Listed Pipe and tubing installed in accordance with is listing that can be of other materials or thicknesses.

 

[cda]

CDA They get around that by 6.3.4 and 6.3.6 for Listed Pipe and tubing installed in accordance with is listing that can be of other materials or thicknesses.

Are those more of the systems such as the clamp type??

 

[Frank]

Yes.. PozLok was an o-ring seal and a drive on denting keeper for sched 5 pipe. Keeper was U shaped and went into slot in the fitting and you drove it across the pipe with a hammer.

Some others are crimp on systems where a power crimper clamps the fitting onto the pipe.

Victaulic has a pressfit system for use with schedule 5.

Wheatland makes a schedule 5

But Its Corrosion Rate Ration is significantly lower than that of Schedule 40 0.61 to 0.25 for 1 inch to 2 inch pipe.

I have not seen one but it would not surprize me if some one had a shark bite style fitting listed for use with schedule 5.

Some of the thinner pipe is also listed for use with regular roll groove fitting just closer tolerances on the roll groover operation so you don't cut it when making the groove.

NFPA does NOT factor durability into NFPA 13 requirements.

 

[mtlogcabin]

Sorry I should have said "Pipe Schedule"

We have seen 10 and 40 but never anything lighter. We do have a lot lot of dry or antifreeze partial systems.

 

[cda]

Sorry I should have said "Pipe Schedule"We have seen 10 and 40 but never anything lighter. We do have a lot lot of dry or antifreeze partial systems.

Looks like listed pipe is allowed schedule whatever