• Welcome to the new and improved Building Code Forum. We appreciate you being here and hope that you are getting the information that you need concerning all codes of the building trades. This is a free forum to the public due to the generosity of the Sawhorses, Corporate Supporters and Supporters who have upgraded their accounts. If you would like to have improved access to the forum please upgrade to Sawhorse by first logging in then clicking here: Upgrades

Stair, Guard or neither?

P

Pais

Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2009
Messages
16
Location
Northern Black Hills
I am reviewing a proposed elementary school. There is a commons/cafeteria area adjacent to a gymnasium with a 16" elevation difference with the gym floor being lower. This area is 48' wide. A guard is not required per section 1013 (2006 IBC) because it is less than 30" above the floor below. Would a 48' wide stairway be required because there is a rise of more than 7"? There is a seperate stairway and ramp that access this area.
 
Re: Stair, Guard or neither?

Their choice. Lower the entire single step to 7 inches for the entire 48 foot length or put in the guard or a full height wall.

Of course without the plan I can't be certain. ADA probably kicks in somewhere.
 
Re: Stair, Guard or neither?

I think I disagree. If they have a compliant stairway, and the remainder of the elevation change is less than 30", how can you require anything there?

To close to quitting time. Will check further tomorrow.

GPE
 
Re: Stair, Guard or neither?

All elevation changes less than 12 inches are required to be by a ramp. A single riser stair is not permitted. The building code would not prohibit the proposed installation, regardless of how bad it is. I would have to check accessibility to see if it would be a problem there.
 
Re: Stair, Guard or neither?

Coug Dad:

Where does it say that?

Stair riser height can be 4 inches; thus, three risers for a 12-inch elevation, or two risers at 6 inches.

There is nothing in the code that prohibits a single-riser stair...as a matter of fact, the definition of a stair is a "change of elevation, consisting of one or more risers."
 
Re: Stair, Guard or neither?

As dangerous as it may appear, if they have all egress issues taken care of by way of ramps and stairs (ADA and otherwise) there is no requirement to do anything at all. Under 30", no guard required.
 
Re: Stair, Guard or neither?

Again, I think without the plan in front of us, we are all just spinning our wheels here. But I wouldn't be happy with an 18 inch drop off. What kind of knucklehead would leave that in a design?
 
Re: Stair, Guard or neither?

RLGA, Section 1003.5 (2006) Prohibits single riser stairs with a few exceptions. Changes of elevation of less than 12 inches must be by a ramp.
 
Re: Stair, Guard or neither?

Coug Dad:

You're right. I've never had a situation where this was an issue. Thanks for pointing that out.
 
Re: Stair, Guard or neither?

A lawyer I met years ago called that his money section of the code. Single riser stair, person falls, slam dunk case, 40% in the bank.
 
Re: Stair, Guard or neither?

Aside from ' the code ' and any requirements, if the stage egress and accessibility requirements are satisfied, what would

be a reasonable, prudent and acceptable design to this conundrum?

A. Leave it alone and do nothing. Let the school decide if they want some type of guards installed.

B. Have compliant steps installed along the entire width

C. Install cargo netting along the entire front so that "when" someone falls, the netting will catch them.

D. Install 8"-12" of cushioning along the entire front of the stage area

E. Other...

 
Re: Stair, Guard or neither?

Code doesn't require it (I think we've established that).

Stairs can be added, but they must comply with the code.

In the little work I've done with school districts, most had a risk management firm review all documents, make inspections during construction, and report back to the district with any potential liability issues. If this school is in a district that has a similar process, I'm sure it will be caught (eventually) and corrected. Since this is an elementary school, 30 inches is like 5 feet (or more) to us adults.

If I was reviewing the project, then I would advise the designer or owner to install a guard.
 
Re: Stair, Guard or neither?

The OP did not say that this was a stage condition. Stages have unprotected edges and there is nothing that can realistically be done about them. If this is just a drop off between spaces, I would suggest a guardrail even though the drop off is less than 30 inches. The guard rail could be less than 42 inches and not prevent the passing of a 4 inch sphere.
 
Re: Stair, Guard or neither?

Coug Dad,

You are correct! :D I was wrong to attach the ' stage ' designation.

 
Re: Stair, Guard or neither?

Coug Dad said:
The guard rail could be less than 42 inches and not prevent the passing of a 4 inch sphere.
Click to expand...
Ah, now that opens up a new can of worms, and I think I disagree with you. For example, a 30" high guard where none was required could now become something that someone could step back into and fall over it resulting in a worse fall than if there was not guard there. An opening larger than 4" could allow a child to get caught in it producing a hazard worse than the unprotected < 30" drop. I think this is one of those places where the code doesn't require a guard, but if you build one, it has to comply with the code for guards.
 
Re: Stair, Guard or neither?

Agree with EPrice: If you build something that the code regulates, even though the code doesn't require that particular something in your specific instance, and you don't build it in accordance with the code, you've made an error that the litigators will eventually exploit to your detriment.

I also agree there is no requirement in the IBC for a stair or guard, in the scenario as described.
 
Re: Stair, Guard or neither?

Not defending the design here, but Pais: as you look at the plan, is it possible that the 16" drop is functioning as a type of fixed bench for sitting and viewing the gym activities? (Conversely, would utilizing the wall as a seat narrow down an intended path-of-travel?)

It's not uncommon to see 16" high retaining walls utilized as a built-in bench seat for viewing events, particulary if it's near a recreational activity.
 
Re: Stair, Guard or neither?

Would exception #2, 3, 4, or 5 of Section 1013.1 apply?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top