Won-Doors serving an assembly occupancy

[atomahutna]

I've got a proposed Won-Door serving an A-2 occupancy(hospital cafeteria). The ES report and IBC 1008.1.3.3 allow the use in any occupancy except H and require the the door opens to the required exit width in 10 seconds.

My question is, can a won door be used where panic hardware would normally be required? The actual set up is that one of the required exits is thru a corridor with 2 won doors across it.

It seems to me that 10 seconds could be a long time if people are piling up at the Won-Door doors. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Tom

 

[JBI]

Re: Won-Doors serving an assembly occupancy

Tom - Among the requirements,

"1. The doors shall be power operated and shall be capable of being operated manually in the event of power failure."

They might not have to wait a full 10 seconds; manual operation OR maybe the unit proposed has a faster motor than the maximum permitted 10 second delay.

 

[brudgers]

Re: Won-Doors serving an assembly occupancy

If won-doors are being specified for aesthetics (usually the case) then the full recessed width is probably more than adequate.

Otherwise the corridor would be near capacity and that's unlikely in a hospital as other factors typically determine corridor width.

The piling up is a non-issue in my opinion.

It's not that doors don't open for 10 seconds.

They just don't recess into the walls for 10 seconds.

For a crowd to hit the doors in the first 10 seconds seems improbable given the uses and functions of a hospital and experience.

 

[cda]

Re: Won-Doors serving an assembly occupancy

check 3.6.1 on the report

http://www.wondoor.com/images/phase_two ... 202007.pdf

for get the rest of this stuff

good question that section does not prohibit it,

But look at 11008.1.8.6 IBC 2003 and delayed egress of 15-30 secinds is not allowed in "A's"

and if you look at 1008.1.9 panic hardware does won dor meet it???

never had the question come up, and have not thought about it

One other idea since you are in an A setting you do have other doors, can you meet travel distance and occupant load with those???

and also would this be considered, or is an horizontal exit???

 

[brudgers]

Re: Won-Doors serving an assembly occupancy

Do the Won-doors even have a latch or are they being used for smoke compartments as is common for hospitals?

 

[atomahutna]

Re: Won-Doors serving an assembly occupancy

I'm just doing a preliminary review, but the doors create an elevator lobby that I guess is a part of the the smoke compartment (floor to floor at least).

I just don't know how a won door operates manually. Can you just just shove on a panel and it swings open?

 

[brudgers]

Re: Won-Doors serving an assembly occupancy

I'm just doing a preliminary review, but the doors create an elevator lobby that I guess is a part of the the smoke compartment (floor to floor at least). I just don't know how a won door operates manually. Can you just just shove on a panel and it swings open?

That's typical with smoke compartment doors in hospitals.

Normally open on mag holds.

Allow easy passage during alarm event.

I recommend calling up the architect and listening.

 

[cda]

Re: Won-Doors serving an assembly occupancy

atomahutna

these are horizontal sliding doors, the do not swing

http://www.wondoor.com/images/large_ima ... _ds_lg.jpg

http://wondoor.com/video_archive.php

been awhile since delt with won dor

normaly you hit the bar and the door opens a predetermined distance than will close unless the bar is pushed

manual appears you just push/ slide it open

check page 2 and 3:::::

http://wondoor.com/Pages/docs/fg_oman.pdf

 

[cda]

Re: Won-Doors serving an assembly occupancy

http://www.wondoor.com/videos/product_demo_3GPP.3gp

 

[Yikes]

Re: Won-Doors serving an assembly occupancy

Won Doors all operat via motor, with battery back-up. When you hit the "panic bar" on a won door, the motor slides the door open, usually for just a predetermined distance that is the equivalent of a conventional door opening (3 to 4'), then it will close again after a predetermined time.

"A Won-Door employee remembers his encounter with a Marine General who had helped with the installation at the Pentagon. The General stated that on the morning of Sept. 11, he was working in his office adjacent to the hallway where one of the Won-Door doors was located, when he felt the building begin to vibrate violently. As he stepped out of his office into the hallway, all he could see was a fireball coming down the hallway towards him, until the door closed in front of him, blocking him from the oncoming blast. He felt no impact from the blast and detected no smoke or fire coming through the door."

http://govtsecurity.com/mag/opportunity_knocks/

 

[RLM-Architect]

Re: Won-Doors serving an assembly occupancy

WonDoors are a great product a they do the job they are designed for.

The solve a particular set of issues and have been tested and meet (actually exceed) the opening protection requirements.

If you want a real eye opening experience, go to the manufacturer in Salt Lake City and get a tour.

Lacking the travel, go to their web site and look around. You can get most of your questions answered and it should help your concerns for the product. Note that under the "Horizontal Sliding" fire rated door section, to my kowledge, it is the only product that complies with all requirements.

As a point of interest, that section was entered into Code because of this innovation in opening protection.