Door swing clearance

[FakeArchitect]

Hey!
Any advice appreciated on this, can door push clearances and Door swing overlap each other? Like the one in the image?

I’ve done some research and was not able to find something definitive, or maybe my research or understanding might be deficient…

 

[RLGA]

There is no prohibition in either the ICC A117.1 or the ADA/ABA Standards against doors swinging into the maneuvering clearances of another door.

 

[FakeArchitect]

There is no prohibition in either the ICC A117.1 or the ADA/ABA Standards against doors swinging into the maneuvering clearances of another door.

Appreciate the quick response sir!

I looked into TAS as well,under Chapter 4 there is a door in series which lists a minimum of 48” between doors in addition to the width of the door. But it is a different situation than the one attached…
It does list that the door maneuvering clearance can overlap, but in this situation it’s the door swing itself that is in the clearance..

 

[arwat23]

Appreciate the quick response sir!

I looked into TAS as well,under Chapter 4 there is a door in series which lists a minimum of 48” between doors in addition to the width of the door. But it is a different situation than the one attached…
It does list that the door maneuvering clearance can overlap, but in this situation it’s the door swing itself that is in the clearance..

Depending on the space around these doors and the jurisdiction, this might be considered "doors in a series". I've have jurisdictions call this situation that before (even though I disagree with them). Just wanted to share in case your jurisdiction has that same opinion.

As far as I'm aware, there's nothing saying doors cannot overlap the maneuvering clearances of other doors. Here's a link to something that applies to ADAS (probably applies to TAS too since my understanding is that TAS is mostly ADAS). My understanding the list in that link are the only times a door's swing cannot overlap another required clearance.

 

[FakeArchitect]

Depending on the space around these doors and the jurisdiction, this might be considered "doors in a series". I've have jurisdictions call this situation that before (even though I disagree with them). Just wanted to share in case your jurisdiction has that same opinion.

As far as I'm aware, there's nothing saying doors cannot overlap the maneuvering clearances of other doors. Here's a link to something that applies to ADAS (probably applies to TAS too since my understanding is that TAS is mostly ADAS). My understanding the list in that link are the only times a door's swing cannot overlap another required clearance.

Really appreciate the input and link. This is super helpful.
The doors are in a bit of a bind, but the door with clearance in red opens into corridor on either side and the other door opens into a room. But as far as the link goes, I think they don’t fall in any of those situations…
Thanks!

 

[arwat23]

Do both of these doors have closers? Could you argue that the door to the left has a hinge approach rather than a front approach?

If there's concern (code or practice) with the maneuvering clearance and door swing, removing the closer or calling for a hinge approach may be sufficient to get the maneuvering clearance out of the door swing.

 

[FakeArchitect]

Do both of these doors have closers? Could you argue that the door to the left has a hinge approach rather than a front approach?

If there's concern (code or practice) with the maneuvering clearance and door swing, removing the closer or calling for a hinge approach may be sufficient to get the maneuvering clearance out of the door swing.

Appreciate the discussion, I am learning a lot just by having this conversation.
Apologies for the delayed response. I was trying to get more information on this lol, the door to the left is a secured door which has closer, the right one does not... You think this could be an issue if these are considered a series of doors? Thanks

 

[arwat23]

You think this could be an issue if these are considered a series of doors?

It's possible. Most jurisdictions I've worked in wouldn't consider this doors in a series. There is one, however, that would undoubtable consider this doors in a series.

Odds are you're probably okay.

 

[walker.t]

the door with clearance in red

You might want to call out the dimension to the door jamb to keep the corner of the door maneuvering clearance out of the wall, also to give the framers a little room for error.

 

[Yikes]

See also my post and the larger thread here from 2022: https://www.thebuildingcodeforum.com/forum/threads/two-doors-in-a-series.31230/post-257723

It references the image of an accessible hotel room as published by the USDOJ in section 806 of https://www.ada.gov/regs2010/2010ADAStandards/Guidance2010ADAstandards.htm

That hotel room had a bathroom door that was closer than 4' from the hotel room entry door.

 

[Paul Sweet]

ADASAD 304.4 allows doors to swing into a turning space, so I think that a door swing can overlap a maneuvering clearance as long as it leaves a clear 30" x 48" space for a wheelchair.