doors equipped with a power door operator need not to provide clear space on the latch side

[sunyaer]

The following is from Ontario Building Code, Division B, Part 3:
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3.8.3.3. Doorways and Doors
...
(10) Unless equipped with a power door operator, a door in a barrier-free path of travel shall have a clear space on the
latch side extending the height of the doorway and not less than,
(a) 600 mm beyond the edge of the door opening if the door swings toward the approach side,
(b) 300 mm beyond the edge of the door opening if the door swings away from the approach side, and
(c) 300 mm beyond both sides of a sliding door.
...
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This is the Ontario Building Code Appendix A (explanations to the code):

It looks to me that doors equipped with a power door operator shall also meet the requirements of clear space addressed in 3.8.3.3.(10), while based on the wording of the above 3.8.3.3.(10), doors equipped with a power door operator need not to provide clear space on the latch side, which in my opinion is wrong, am I correct?

 

[e hilton]

Why is it wrong? Are you saying your interpretation is wrong, or the workaround is wrong? I have used a power operator a couple of times when it’s physically impossible to modify the building to get proper clearance, but we either need or want to provide accessibility.

 

[mark handler]

What happens when the power goes out?

 

[e hilton]

Door operates normally.

 

[mark handler]

Door operates normally.

And that is why you need clearances, like any other door.
or provide battery backup.

ehilton
think as if YOU are in the chair, not as if a non-chair user is using it.

 

[e hilton]

I’m glad you live in a perfect textbook world.

 

[steveray]

Do you guys get to look in ANSI or in your case...CANSI?

404.3.4 Maneuvering Clearances​

Maneuvering clearances at power-assisted doors and gates shall comply with Section 404.2.3. Maneuvering clearances complying with Section 404.2.3 shall be provided on the egress side of low-energy automatic and full power automatic doors and gates that serve as part of an accessible means of egress.
Exceptions:

1. Low-energy automatic and full power automatic doors and gates that have standby power or battery back-up shall not be required to comply with this section.
2. Low-energy automatic and full power automatic doors and gates that remain open in the power-off condition shall not be required to comply with this section.
3. Full power automatic sliding doors and gates that include a break-away feature shall not be required to comply with this section.

 

[mark handler]

I’m glad you live in a perfect textbook world.

REALY?

 

[mark handler]

Do you guys get to look in ANSI or in your case...CANSI?

404.3.4 Maneuvering Clearances​

Maneuvering clearances at power-assisted doors and gates shall comply with Section 404.2.3. Maneuvering clearances complying with Section 404.2.3 shall be provided on the egress side of low-energy automatic and full power automatic doors and gates that serve as part of an accessible means of egress.
Exceptions:

1. Low-energy automatic and full power automatic doors and gates that have standby power or battery back-up shall not be required to comply with this section.
2. Low-energy automatic and full power automatic doors and gates that remain open in the power-off condition shall not be required to comply with this section.
3. Full power automatic sliding doors and gates that include a break-away feature shall not be required to comply with this

I knew that, I'm trying to make people think.....

 

[tmurray]

The following is from Ontario Building Code, Division B, Part 3:
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3.8.3.3. Doorways and Doors
...
(10) Unless equipped with a power door operator, a door in a barrier-free path of travel shall have a clear space on the
latch side extending the height of the doorway and not less than,
(a) 600 mm beyond the edge of the door opening if the door swings toward the approach side,
(b) 300 mm beyond the edge of the door opening if the door swings away from the approach side, and
(c) 300 mm beyond both sides of a sliding door.
...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is the Ontario Building Code Appendix A (explanations to the code):
View attachment 11100
It looks to me that doors equipped with a power door operator shall also meet the requirements of clear space addressed in 3.8.3.3.(10), while based on the wording of the above 3.8.3.3.(10), doors equipped with a power door operator need not to provide clear space on the latch side, which in my opinion is wrong, am I correct?

It is good practice to provide both clearance and the power operators, but the code allows you to eliminate the clearance if a power operator is provided.

 

[mark handler]

It is good practice to provide both clearance and the power operators, but the code allows you to eliminate the clearance if a power operator is provided.

you mean in case the, "power door operator" doesn't work... which means, in the case where the power goes out, you no longer have a power door operator.

 

[tmurray]

you mean in case the, "power door operator" doesn't work... which means, in the case where the power goes out, you no longer have a power door operator.

Using a power operator is an acceptable compliance option when required clearances cannot be provided.

I'm always at least a little hesitant to play the "what if" game when it comes to code compliance.

What if the power goes out?
What if the button breaks?
What if the operator breaks?

All of these things could happen. However, if we accept the fact that the intent of the code is that if the power operator ceases to function, even temporarily, the clearance must be provided, We create two problems. From a code interpretation standpoint, 3.8.3.3.(10) now makes absolutely no sense. Secondly, we have created an environment that actively disincentivizes the use of power operators.

Without clearer code language to this effect, I do not think this interpretation would be upheld at higher levels.

 

[e hilton]

Here’s the problem. The top door is the accessible entrance. Cannot increase clearance plan south because of the lower level stair path. Cannot increase clearance north because of the unisex restroom and the structural column. Solution was to add an operator with the inside button marked D2 and a button on the outside out of the picture.

 

[e hilton]

Another similar problem. Branch bank. This is not the accessible entrance, but because the way the building is on the property 95% of the customers enter here, so we have made it as compliant as possible, to the point that it could be the ada entrance.
The middle picture is view from outside … looks like a pair of doors. (The opposite end of the building is identical, and both doors open). Plan shows a safe deposit vault plan north, that cannot be moved. And a structural column south. Third pic shows the hallway. To make it accessible we installed a powered opener. Perfect? No, but compliant and functional.

 

[Inspector Gadget]

Do you guys get to look in ANSI or in your case...CANSI?

In our case, it's a CSA standard.