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Egress for unenclosed space/horizontal exit

Discussion in 'Commercial Building Codes' started by jl3, Jun 30, 2020.

  1. jl3

    jl3 Registered User

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    Hi All,

    We have a pool addition to a rec center, both buildings A3, sprinklered, and in the image below, our addition is to the right (east) where we have a 2hr separation and are sending about 1/3 of the occupants from the new building into the existing lounge space.

    Since the lounge space is unenclosed, we're unsure of whether or not this space can be used as the area that the horizontal exit discharges into or how the number of exits is considered within this space. The arrows pointing north/south are corridors that lead to exterior exit doors and the arrow to the west leads to the main lobby; can the corridors leading north/south be considered (2) exits, or would we need some other point of exit for the existing lounge space?

    [​IMG]
     
  2. cda

    cda Sawhorse

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    Would help to see overall or more of the floor plan


    Why the two hour wall??
     
  3. cda

    cda Sawhorse

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    Sounds like you do not have a exiting problem
     
  4. jl3

    jl3 Registered User

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    Here's an overall

    [​IMG]

    We have a 2hr wall because we're over the allowable SF with the addition.
     
  5. jl3

    jl3 Registered User

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    Image link didn't work... red is new addition
    [​IMG]
     
  6. cda

    cda Sawhorse

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    What is your required exit width?

    WHY the two hour wall??



    I don’t think you have a problem
     
  7. Ty J.

    Ty J. Sawhorse

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    Has the 2-hr fire rate assembly been designed as a fire wall? It must be structurally independent and allow collapse of the structure on either side of the wall and maintain its required separation requirement.

    706.2 Structural Stability
    Fire walls shall be designed and constructed to allow collapse of the structure on either side without collapse of the wall under fire conditions. Fire walls designed and constructed in accordance with NFPA 221 shall be deemed to comply with this section.
     
  8. RLGA

    RLGA Sawhorse

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    Whether a fire wall or horizontal exit, there doesn't appear to be an issue with exiting for the addition. However, the lounge may have a problem. Was there originally an exterior exit door that was blocked off by the addition? If so, the lounge space requires two means of egress and the wide opening on the one side may not qualify for the 1/3-of-the-overall-diagonal rule for a sprinklered condition.

    If using the 2-hour wall as a horizontal exit, then the public areas of the existing building become the refuge area, and its capacity must be based on the exit width provided through the horizontal exit.
     
  9. jl3

    jl3 Registered User

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    The intention is for the wall to be a fire wall, separate foundations and such. Needed because we're over the allowable SF.

    We're fine as far as egress width is concerned, mostly unsure of whether or not the existing lounge space (which has 117 occupants and would need 2 exits) can consider the 2 corridors north/south as the exits, or if the "opening" on the left side of the lounge space where the wing wall is, is considered a single "exit"
     
  10. jl3

    jl3 Registered User

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    Correct, there was an existing exterior exit for the lounge where the addition is going up; the wide opening is about 20 ft, with our diagonal dimension for the lounge being 60 ft, we were discussing removing the wing wall if that would help our situation.
     
  11. cda

    cda Sawhorse

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    Does the exit bottom right from the pool area dump into an enclosed area??

    Are you sure about your exiting from the pool area????????
     
    #11 cda, Jun 30, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2020
  12. cda

    cda Sawhorse

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    Good question on the lounge!
     
  13. cda

    cda Sawhorse

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    Can you meet 1/3 by adding a door in that wing wall?? By the bathroom

    Bottom left of the lounge, as you look at it.
     
  14. RLGA

    RLGA Sawhorse

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    The fire wall can be considered a horizontal exit, so the occupants egressing through it would not be added to the occupant load germane to the lounge area.

    Regrading overall diagonal measurement, you have to consider the entire area that it is egressing, which includes the alcove area and the laundry and janitor spaces.
     

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