Elevator Door

[LGreene]

Someone sent me the attached photo of a fire door mounted over an elevator door and asked why it was required. I know it must have something to do with the fire resistance of the shaft, but it's not a common situation. Can any of you give me some insight?

View attachment 1676

View attachment 1676

/monthly_2012_04/572953e5b14e9_ElevatorDoorSmall.JPG.9f3d8528b51a37951435aab5e495449e.JPG

 

[Coug Dad]

Flop doors to prevent the passage of smoke from one floor to another when the elevator opens into a rated corridor such as in a hotel. The hoistway door provides the fire resistive rating but is not smoke tight. The flop door provides the smoke seal. A lobby is required above a certain level (don't have the code in front of me) so this approach is common used in small hotels, apartments, condos and other residential occupancies where a rated corridor is required.

 

[DennisK]

Ya, what he said. The extra door is probably there to meet an exception to the requirement for an elevator lobby (708.14.1). There are other exceptions, of course. Without knowing the complete details of the building can't say but Exception 3 to 708.14.1 seems likely.

DK Engineering PLLC

dkengineer.com

 

[mark handler]

It is for smoke. the shaft acts as a chimney in a fire

you can also use a Smoke Curtain

ICC report attached

http://www.smokeguard.com/products/400.aspx

http://www.icc-es.org/reports/pdf_files/ICC-ES/ESR-1136.pdf

 

[fatboy]

Same as above, we see it here as they said, to get around the lobby requirement.

 

[tmurray]

It is for smoke. the shaft acts as a chimney in a fireyou can also use a Smoke Curtain

ICC report attached

http://www.smokeguard.com/products/400.aspx

http://www.icc-es.org/reports/pdf_files/ICC-ES/ESR-1136.pdf

is the exit sign just above floor height required down there in the US, or is that just someone going above and beyond?

 

[mark handler]

is the exit sign just above floor height required down there in the US, or is that just someone going above and beyond?

The "floor level" exit signs Required based on occupancy

CA Building Code 1011.6 Floor-level exit signs. Where exit signs are required by Chapter 10, additional approved low-level exit signs which are internally or externally illuminated photoluminescent or self-luminous, shall be provided in all interior corridors of Group A, E, I and R-2.1 occupancies and in all interior rated exit corridors serving guest rooms of hotels in Group R, Division 1 occupancies.

Exceptions:

1. Group A occupancies that are protected throughout by an approved supervised fire sprinkler system.

2. Group E occupancies where direct exits have been provided from each classroom.

3. Group I and R-2.1 occupancies which are provided with smoke barriers constructed in accordance with Section 407.4

4. Group I-3 occupancies.

The bottom of the sign shall not be less than 6 inches (152 mm) or more than 8 inches (203 mm) above the floor level and shall indicate the path of exit travel. For exit and exit-access doors, the sign shall be on the door or adjacent to the door with the closest edge of the sign or marker within 4 inches (102 mm) of the door frame.

Note: Pursuant to Health and Safety Code Section 13143, this California amendment applies to all newly constructed buildings or structures subject to this section for which a building permit is issued (or construction commenced, where no building permit is issued) on or after January 1, 1989.

 

[Coug Dad]

Smoke Guard can be difficult to reset after multiple false alarm trips. The flop doors are held open with conventional magnetic devices.

 

[mark handler]

Never had a problem with them

The system is easily reset by activating the rewind switch.

http://products.construction.com/swts_content_files/3523/P74926.htm

 

[Big Mac]

I like those floor level exit signs. Should be put back into the code.

 

[Coug Dad]

I like those floor level exit signs. Should be put back into the code.

If the smoke is that low in the corridor, stay in your room!

 

[Big Mac]

Doesn't have to be anywhere near that low to obscure the exit signs above doors.

 

[Builder Bob]

I beleive the lower exit signs is a holdover from the old UBC requirments....

 

[fireguy]

It is for smoke. the shaft acts as a chimney in a fireyou can also use a Smoke Curtain

ICC report attached

http://www.smokeguard.com/products/400.aspx

http://www.icc-es.org/reports/pdf_files/ICC-ES/ESR-1136.pdf

First (and only building we do) with those things surprised the hell out of us. We tripped the smoke and the lower door opened up and the yellow thing dropped to the door, more or less. The cable support was not wound on the spool and it kept winding up crooked. We finally wound it by hand and had the customer call the installer to correct the problem. It is funny to have a new tech stand so the curtain falls just infront of their face. Even funnier is when we mis-calculate and the curtain falls on their head.

I think smoke doors are a better option.

 

[mark handler]

I beleive the lower exit signs is a holdover from the old UBC requirments....

It is in the NFPA 101 as well. Not a holdover from the old UBC requirments

 

[Builder Bob]

Mark,

I am getting more and more forgetful, I was in Alaska in 1999 prior to the wonderful development of the I-codes. What building code was Alaske using in 1999 ? The motel I was in had the signage about 18 " AFF and doors over the elevator shafts.......