Existing Multi-Family Residential Converting to Restaurant

[Hung Nguyen]

Forgot one othe c&p::


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Sounds like you need to set down with the city and go through all this.

You are going to occupy the entire 2nd floor??

Not rent out any of it??
yes this is true. It will not be a rental. I will occupy the whole house

I confirmed with the building department that the house is a 2 unit dwellings - so it is an R-3 on second floor and B on second floor. But based on JBI, it is treated the same. regardless..

 

[cda]

I confirmed with the building department that the house is a 2 unit dwellings - so it is an R-3 on second floor and B on second floor. But based on JBI, it is treated the same. regardless..

Yea but,,,

Talking steaks and chicken

May now be labeled a two unit dwelling, one term

But what occupancy type??? r -1 r-2 r-3 r-4???

Than the question comes in, since you will be the only person living there and you own it,

Will it than be and R-3 and do you have to do some of that magical paperwork to get it to and R-3????

 

[Hung Nguyen]

Yea but,,,

Talking steaks and chicken

May now be labeled a two unit dwelling, one term

But what occupancy type??? r -1 r-2 r-3 r-4???

Than the question comes in, since you will be the only person living there and you own it,

Will it than be and R-3 and do you have to do some of that magical paperwork to get it to and R-3????

If it was a 2 unit dwelling, i thought it would be in R-3 group?

 

[JBI]

To be clear... a 2-family dwelling under the Residential Code is not an R occupancy. A single dwelling unit above a business in a mixed use building is an R-3 occupancy.
IF the 2-family dwelling was built or regulated under the IRC then the dwelling portion becomes a change of occupancy.
IF the 2-family dwelling was built or regulated under the IBC, then it is not a change of occupancy for the dwelling portion of the building.
This will determine whether you are dealing a partial or complete change of occupancy under chapter 34 of the IBC (or under the IEBC is applicable)
This is an important distinction to determine the scope and application of the Code for this project.

Words matter.

 

[JCraver]

Yes, exactly that. ^^^^^^^^^^

If this was built under the IRC back in the day, and has since been converted to a commercial building (which is what I believe I understand from your original post), then you have a complete change of occupancy. Complete change of occupancy with an R occupancy present = sprinklers.

Sorry. It was a good question, and sometimes there are "ways around" some code requirements. This just isn't one of those times..

 

[Francis Vineyard]

As I understand the provisions for 1 & 2 family dwellings a NFPA 13D system would be applicable although it's (a) business that would not require a sprinkler system.

 

[Hung Nguyen]

To be clear... a 2-family dwelling under the Residential Code is not an R occupancy. A single dwelling unit above a business in a mixed use building is an R-3 occupancy.
IF the 2-family dwelling was built or regulated under the IRC then the dwelling portion becomes a change of occupancy.
IF the 2-family dwelling was built or regulated under the IBC, then it is not a change of occupancy for the dwelling portion of the building.
This will determine whether you are dealing a partial or complete change of occupancy under chapter 34 of the IBC (or under the IEBC is applicable)
This is an important distinction to determine the scope and application of the Code for this project.

Words matter.

Yes, exactly that. ^^^^^^^^^^

If this was built under the IRC back in the day, and has since been converted to a commercial building (which is what I believe I understand from your original post), then you have a complete change of occupancy. Complete change of occupancy with an R occupancy present = sprinklers.

Sorry. It was a good question, and sometimes there are "ways around" some code requirements. This just isn't one of those times..

Thanks so much for the clarification. My house was built in 1899 - how would i go about finding out whether my house is regulated by by IRC or IBC?

 

[cda]

Thanks so much for the clarification. My house was built in 1899 - how would i go about finding out whether my house is regulated by by IRC or IBC?

It was not built under any of those

Have you had set down meeting with the city and discussed this proposal with them??

That is who you need to make happy and they will be calling the shoots.

You can always adjust to what they say

 

[JCraver]

Thanks so much for the clarification. My house was built in 1899 - how would i go about finding out whether my house is regulated by by IRC or IBC?

You said it was zoned commercial now, right? And the City knows of your plan to make the first floor a take-out joint? If those are true, then you now have a commercial building. The fact that's it looks like a house and that is was built in the middle ages makes no difference.

 

[Hung Nguyen]

You said it was zoned commercial now, right? And the City knows of your plan to make the first floor a take-out joint? If those are true, then you now have a commercial building. The fact that's it looks like a house and that is was built in the middle ages makes no difference.

Hi, yes. the house was built in a Business zone, and have been in that zone since (i'm not sure if there is a difference between Business zone vs Commercial zone). And yes, the building does know about my plan. It's just that they are asking my architect to provide a code analysis to make the first floor into a take-out joint and my architecture is having trouble coming up with the applicable codes regarding the automatic fire sprinkler.

 

[cda]

Hi, yes. the house was built in a Business zone, and have been in that zone since (i'm not sure if there is a difference between Business zone vs Commercial zone). And yes, the building does know about my plan. It's just that they are asking my architect to provide a code analysis to make the first floor into a take-out joint and my architecture is having trouble coming up with the applicable codes regarding the automatic fire sprinkler.

Has the city said that a fire sprinkler is required???

 

[Hung Nguyen]

Has the city said that a fire sprinkler is required???

the inspector that i was talking to didnt mention anything - but he seems to be flexible as long as we can proof to him we dont need it

 

[cda]

the inspector that i was talking to didnt mention anything - but he seems to be flexible as long as we can proof to him we dont need it

Submit the plans with the planned horizontal separation, and no mention of fire sprinklers,,,,

See if it has wings of eagles and flies !!!

 

[ADAguy]

Apples and Oranges, what cooking appliances will you be using? Open flame? If so, then an Ansul system will be required.
If zoned commercial/business it may be a "Live/work" occupancy vs a 2 unit residence.
Also, if 1899 does it fall into a historic district? If so, the cost of sprinklers is inexpensive insurance against fire loss.
Is wiring Knob and tube or in conduit? If K&T it is a potential source of overload and fire? Is building masonry or frame?

 

[cda]

It keeps getting called a 2 unit

I think the owner will be the only occupant

And not renting out any residential space