Fire Area Definition

[Brandon S.]

So I am reviewing a restaurant in a multi-tenant shopping center and I wanted to get some opinions on the exterior patio fire area. The restaurant it self is separated from the rest of the building with a 2-hour fire barrier creating separate fire areas, but there is no separation from the outdoor dining. The indoor dining is at 99 and the outdoor dining is at 67 and they do not want to install a sprinkler system.

The architect is saying these are two different fire areas since the definition of fire area specifies exterior walls as boundaries for fire areas. My understanding is that as long as it is under the roof or building projection it is part of the same fire area on the other side of the exterior wall. What are everyone else's thoughts?

 

[RLGA]

Is the patio cover an actual extension of the roof, or is it a separate structure attached to the building?

 

[steveray]

To clarify...the outdoor area has a roof over the 67 people?

 

[Brandon S.]

Is the patio cover an actual extension of the roof, or is it a separate structure attached to the building?

In this case it is an actual extension of the roof.

 

[Brandon S.]

To clarify...the outdoor area has a roof over the 67 people?

Yes, I meant in terms of occupant load

 

[RLGA]

In this case it is an actual extension of the roof.

Then the outdoor area is a part of the fire area by definition.

 

[Genduct]

Then the outdoor area is a part of the fire area by definition.

But wouldn't the term "Outdoor Area" imply that the space is important as to understand the implications of Egress Path, etc But that Space or Area is ACCESSORY to the ENCLOSED Restaurant (Structure)

The question remain which of the Restaurant Code Considerations will need to be followed and which will need to be reduced to reflect the Lower Risk of this outdoor dining option
I could see the electrical requirements being more robust given the "weather aspect" for instance more GFI's
So, would the existing space need to be improved because of the ADDED people load? In your opinion

 

[steveray]

FIRE AREA. The aggregate floor area enclosed and
bounded by fire walls, fire barriers, exterior walls or horizontal
assemblies of a building. Areas of the building not provided
with surrounding walls shall be included in the fire area
if such areas are included within the horizontal projection of
the roof or floor next above.

 

[Genduct]

FIRE AREA. The aggregate floor area enclosed and
bounded by fire walls, fire barriers, exterior walls or horizontal
assemblies of a building. Areas of the building not provided
with surrounding walls shall be included in the fire area
if such areas are included within the horizontal projection of
the roof or floor next above.

Thanks Steve, you are right, the definition is clear

I was just thinking out load as to how I would evaluate the Intent of the Code when considering this almost Patio type addition to this restaurant. We have had a number of Covid Restaurant additions in Philly and try to understand the real risk to the customers. I was just looking for some additional options to be Safe and Fair

 

[Genduct]

Thanks Steve, you are right, the definition is clear

I was just thinking out load as to how I would evaluate the Intent of the Code when considering this almost Patio type addition to this restaurant. We have had a number of Covid Restaurant additions in Philly and try to understand the real risk to the customers. I was just looking for some additional options to be Safe and Fair

PS I could see for example, of paying more attention to the previous outside wall and making sure it would have some additional fire resistance to any incident between the spaces

 

[steveray]

Is there an S1 use in the plaza? Might need to be 3hr......Unless they cleared that up....


707.3.9 Separated occupancies. Where the provisions of
Section 508.4 are applicable, the fire barrier separating
mixed occupancies shall have a fire-resistance rating of
not less than that indicated in Table 508.4 based on the
occupancies being separated.
707.3.10 Fire areas. The fire barriers or horizontal
assemblies, or both, separating a single occupancy into
different fire areas shall have a fire-resistance rating of
not less than that indicated in Table 707.3.10. The fire barriers
or horizontal assemblies, or both, separating fire
areas of mixed occupancies shall have a fire-resistance
rating of not less than the highest value indicated in Table
707.3.10 for the occupancies under consideration.

 

[mtlogcabin]

The restaurant it self is separated from the rest of the building with a 2-hour fire barrier creating separate fire areas,

If the exterior wall is 2-hour rated then they should be 2 separate and distinct fire areas. Different fire areas have the same roof over them. Rating the exterior wall would meet the intent of the code

707.3.10 Fire areas.
The fire barriers, fire walls or horizontal assemblies, or combination thereof, separating a single occupancy into different fire areas shall have a fire-resistance rating of not less than that indicated in Table 707.3.10. The fire barriers, fire walls or horizontal assemblies, or combination thereof, separating fire areas of mixed occupancies shall have a fire-resistance rating of not less than the highest value indicated in Table 707.3.10 for the occupancies under consideration.

 

[my250r11]

Would most definitely check for egress from patio area. Especially if it has walls/vegetation around it. If they have to re-enter the restaurant then that counts toward occ. load and would trigger sprinklers. If has its own exits then I could get on board with the separation and no sprinklers.

 

[ADAguy]

Last question is important to answer and is it at the same level as the surfaces beyond it?