Grease interceptor in an accessible parking space

[Sifu]

Seems like I have read about this somewhere, but I can't find it. Is there a specific prohibition on a grease interceptor being located in an accessible parking space in the IBC or ANSI 117.1 standard? Or an access aisle?

 

[e hilton]

Could be an issue in an aisle, the surface material could be slippery, might have protrusions, etc.

 

[Sifu]

Could be an issue in an aisle, the surface material could be slippery, might have protrusions, etc.

I get that, but that would be a different violation, which I will caution them on if I can't find a prohibition. I think I read once that they like putting them there because the spaces are often empty, and the aisle is always empty, but that they remove the spaces from service so it isn't best practice. This AHJ has a FOG policy that prohibits them in the parking space, but not the access aisle. I don't want to provide a cautionary note if it isn't permitted in the first place.

 

[ICE]

not the access aisle

That would work until it doesn't. The pumper goes to work with a patron parked in the accessible stall. The patron shows up and can't leave with the pumper in action. Remote possibility? One carload of dissatisfied patrons? Compare that with the expense/hassle of moving the GI to a different location.

 

[north star]

# # = # #

In the `17 ANSI A117.1, Section 502.4.4 & 503.3.4 - Marking: "Access aisles shall be
marked so as to discourage parking in them".

& * & * &

 

[Sifu]

I am guessing the truck would not park in the aisle...they would park either in the adjacent spaces or the circulation path, but they would have to utilize the aisle while pumping. I watched a couple of videos online (you can literally find anything on the internet), took about 30-min. or less, on a 3 month schedule. I am thinking it is not a violation to occupy the aisle for that length of time or frequency as long as the surface meets the code.

 

[steveray]

In new i would discourage it....

 

[Yikes]

There are all kinds of manhole covers and utility box covers installed all the time in drive aisles and other areas, including exit paths of travel, that would render the space unusable for temporary periods, perhaps shutting down the entire parking lot. Heck, leaves falling onto an accessible parking stall can make the surface technically noncompliant.

There is no prohibition that I know of in 2010 ADAS, the IBC or the CBC against utility covers (including grease interceptors.
ehilton has it right: the interceptor cover has to meet all the requirements for the surface: slip resistance, slope, maximum vertical change of 1/4", maximum gap width of 1/2", correct striping and markings (if located within those areas.

The other issue as it relates to ADA is: what happens when the grease interceptor is being pumped and someone wants to park in that ADA spot? Unlike when it is in the middle of the drive aisle and blocks all cars, this may block only the accessible stall while allowing others who have no disabilities to park in the rest of the lot. Now you have the potential for discrimination to exist during that time period. But this would be discrimination based on policy, not on design. For example of a solution, there could be a policy that the grease interceptor only gets emptied when the business is closed or the parking lot is entirely shut down.

So it is code-compliant at time of installation. It is certainly not ideal. And if I were a serial ADA litigant, I would go after the designer anyway, just because they might have deep-pockets insurance and I could make a tenuous connection to the service discrimination problem.

 

[e hilton]

The other issue as it relates to ADA is: what happens when the grease interceptor is being pumped and someone wants to park in that ADA spot?

That’s no different than if there is another HC car already in the space when the new vehicle pulls into the lot. It’s a temporary situation.

 

[Mr. Inspector]

The pumper could have a disability and needs a level area to work.

 

[mark handler]

Per the Plumbing code, All interceptors shall be installed in an accessible location to permit the convenient removal of the lid and internal contents.

It is not accessible if you need to find the owner to remove the lid.

 

[mark handler]

Depends on where you are.
FOG Control Program Miami‐Dade County
chrome-extension://efaidnbmnnnibpcajpcglclefindmkaj/https://www.miamidade.gov/environment/library/guidelines/fats-oils-grease-control-program.pdf

 

[mark handler]

2022 CA Building Code​

1009.5 Location​

Each interceptor (clarifier) cover shall be readily accessible for servicing and maintaining the interceptor

Not, "readily accessible" if there is a car parked over it

 

[Sifu]

This AHJ prohibits it "in" a parking space. So they put it in the access aisle of an accessible space. This seems to be a good example of vague "Clintonesque" language that can be exploited, or on the other hand used as a hammer. Does it depend on the definition of "in"? If the separator is greater than 5' wide it will be under the parking space adjacent to the a 5' aisle but not in it. Does that count? The Miami-Dade language is much better, which makes sense since that AHJ is about a 1,000 times larger and has probably learned to be more precise.

 

[Yikes]

Per the Plumbing code, All interceptors shall be installed in an accessible location to permit the convenient removal of the lid and internal contents.

It is not accessible if you need to find the owner to remove the lid.

When you say “owner”, I assume you are not talking about the property owner, but rather you mean owner of a car that might be parked over the lid of the interceptor.
There are many, many properties where access to the lid requires you to first make arrangements with the owner, perhaps to unlock a gate, etc.

The words “accessible location” are subjective, of course. In fact, one could argue (as Rick18071 kinda did) that an accessible parking stall access aisle is the ultimate ”accessible” location.

 

[north star]

$ - $ - $

Technically speaking & interpreting, but isn't the Access Aisle
a part of the Accessible Parking Space ?

$ - $ - $

 

[SCBO1]

Wonder if you could move the ADA parking space doesn't have to be the best spot on the lot? or does it?

You could suggest they move the Employee of the Month space, the Reserved for Owner space, Fire Chief parking only, Veterans' spot or EV parking only spot?

Where's the dumpster location? Can't park in front of the dumpster enclosure or loading and unloading spot either.

Before your done, you'll need a spot for customers only with money.

Don't block the drive thru!


What a pickle!

 

[Mr. Inspector]

$ - $ - $

Technically speaking & interpreting, but isn't the Access Aisle
a part of the Accessible Parking Space ?

$ - $ - $

I think you are right because they are both under section 502 "Parking Spaces" in 1117.1 -2006

 

[mark handler]

Wonder if you could move the ADA parking space doesn't have to be the best spot on the lot? or does it?

You could suggest they move the Employee of the Month space, the Reserved for Owner space, Fire Chief parking only, Veterans' spot or EV parking only spot?

Where's the dumpster location? Can't park in front of the dumpster enclosure or loading and unloading spot either.

Before your done, you'll need a spot for customers only with money.

Don't block the drive thru!


What a pickle!

dumpster location?

OP was for an interceptor (clarifier)???

 

[mark handler]

That’s no different than if there is another HC car already in the space when the new vehicle pulls into the lot. It’s a temporary situation.

There is a difference, the same thing if a non-disabled person parks in the accessible stall. It deprives a disabled person from access.

 

[Yikes]

As long as you temporarily deprive access to all people trying to park (shut down the entire lot, or pump the interceptor only when all buildings served by the lot are closed, etc.), then you are not discriminating against persons with disabilities.

 

[Sifu]

OP was for an interceptor (clarifier)???

Grease interceptor in general but access to be more precise. Local FOG policy prohibits it in a parking space, so they put it in the access aisle (8' van access aisle). I was wondering if there is a specific prohibition in the ANSI 117.1 or IBC to putting it in/under an access aisle, something more specific than the surface and change of level requirements.

 

[north star]

& ~ &

Sifu, ...no specific language regarding the Access Aisle,
however, ...you "might" take the position that the Access
Aisle is part of the actual Accessible Parking Space,
therefore, ...no parking or blocking of either.

Let whomever provide documentation to refute your
position.......Put them on the defense and require that
they defend their position.......To you, your position
& protection of the No Parking \ Blocking is pretty clear.

& ~ &

 

[Yikes]

& ~ &


Aisle is part of the actual Accessible Parking Space,
therefore, ...no parking or blocking of either.

.......To you, your position
& protection of the No Parking \ Blocking is pretty clear.

& ~ &

Of course you can block access to an accessible parking stall, under specific circumstances. Every parking lot owner has the right to limit use to an entire parking lot, via gates, bollards, chains, etc., and it is not discrimination if you deny EVERYONE access to all parking spaces.

It is analogous to locking your doors to the public outside of business hours while you re-stock your shelves.

It is only potentially discriminatory if you allow some public to park while simultaneously taking the accessible parking stalls out of use; in that instance, you can be accused of limiting parking on the basis of disability.