jar546
Forum Coordinator
The things you find without any zoning or building permit being issued or applied for. A residential 2 story garage under construction with space below the planned parking.
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"I did not know I needed a permit" he said
- Thread starter jar546
- Start date
Joe D
Registered User
A bit off topic maybe but code related.....does anyone know exactly when the habitable space egress requirements kicked in for bedrooms, basements, etc. I know all the code requirements for today's construction but when do we go by "the code in effect at time of construction" rule?
The year the building was built
And the code that was adopted when the plans were submitted/ building built.
Is your question on basements?
Most of the code requirements for egress have been the same forever
Basement requirements have changed a little
What state are you in???
Joe D
Registered User
I'm in New York State on Long Island. My question is ...do we assume that emergency escape windows in sleeping rooms and bulkhead basement doors in habitable basements were always in the code in some form or another although size requirements have obviously changed? Just trying to pinpoint if there was a time that codes went into effect for reasons of legality/non conforming by today's codes
Will try to give an answer
Yes size did change, not sure which building code and which edition.
Same problem where you are at, size may have changed. Just not sure which year.
With all that said, normally if you are not touching the Windows, remodeling the specific room, or doing major remodel, the existing windows are normally allowed to remain as is.
What are you doing to the building ? Or are you trying to sale or buy it??
Give Monday or Tuesday and you should get more answers
Yes size did change, not sure which building code and which edition.
Same problem where you are at, size may have changed. Just not sure which year.
With all that said, normally if you are not touching the Windows, remodeling the specific room, or doing major remodel, the existing windows are normally allowed to remain as is.
What are you doing to the building ? Or are you trying to sale or buy it??
Give Monday or Tuesday and you should get more answers
Joe D
Registered User
not doing either I'm a building inspector. Just having trouble getting the info just for my knowledge. Hate to tell someone to change or upgrade anything that was legally installed if they are not required to do so
Ok fantastic
Not into IRC much but I know there is some work that would require them to meet current code.
I just cannot give you code sections and I do not want to tell you wrong. I do stick with the general guidelines I said before.
Also, besides code you run into what your office's normal practice is.
This state changed in 07
https://dps.mn.gov/divisions/sfm/do...olicies-General/INS04(2007)-Egresswindows.pdf
You just need to find out which code and edition were adopted and which year they were adopted, then work backwards to see when the size changed
https://dps.mn.gov/divisions/sfm/do...olicies-General/INS04(2007)-Egresswindows.pdf
You just need to find out which code and edition were adopted and which year they were adopted, then work backwards to see when the size changed
Joe D
Registered User
steveray
SAWHORSE
Call your State people? Maybe JBI will see this and chime in? Rob Drexler ICC board guy is out Syracuse way I believe and Jim Morgenson is up Lake Placid way...
steveray
SAWHORSE
We have had a statewide code since 1971, so anything after is really easy. My Town has had some type of code since the 50's, but a little harder to nail down...Since every AHJ adopts different codes at different times it is impossible for us to know when EERO's started in Long Island, maybe a State person would know better....
Here is my section on "existing to remain":
(Amd) 102.6 Existing structures. The legal use and occupancy of any building or structure
existing on the date of adoption of this code shall be permitted to continue without change, except
as specifically covered in this code or the Connecticut State Fire Safety Code.
When do you require existing to meet current code?
Bedroom remodel, addition to house, other?
steveray
SAWHORSE
JBI
Registered User
New York State adopted its' first Statewide mandatory Code in 1982 with a final effective date in 1984.
Many jurisdictions had adopted enforceable Codes prior to that, including many on Long Island.
In 1984 the Code required 'emergency egress openings' in all 'habitable' spaces.
These openings were a minimum of 4 s.f. with a minimum 18" in either direction.
With the adoption of modified I-Codes in 2002/2003, we moved to the current requirement that applies only to 'sleeping' rooms (not ALL habitable rooms), and the larger size we see today.
First thing you need to do is determine when your jurisdiction first adopted a mandatory Code... but anything after 1984 is bound by the State Code regardless.
Many jurisdictions had adopted enforceable Codes prior to that, including many on Long Island.
In 1984 the Code required 'emergency egress openings' in all 'habitable' spaces.
These openings were a minimum of 4 s.f. with a minimum 18" in either direction.
With the adoption of modified I-Codes in 2002/2003, we moved to the current requirement that applies only to 'sleeping' rooms (not ALL habitable rooms), and the larger size we see today.
First thing you need to do is determine when your jurisdiction first adopted a mandatory Code... but anything after 1984 is bound by the State Code regardless.
Francis Vineyard
Registered User
JBI, sounds like they're way ahead of curve!
2015 IRC
R310.6 Alterations or Repairs of Existing Basements. An emergency escape and rescue opening is not required where existing basements undergo alterations or repairs.
Exception: New sleeping rooms created in an existing basement shall be provided with emergency escape and rescue openings in accordance with Section R310.1
And there's also a reduction of clear opening for replacement EERO windows in accordance with section R310.1.5
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Joe D
Registered User
JBI
Registered User
In the 'green' book (Title 9 Uniform Code), one- and two-family dwellings were referred to as A-1 and A-2 Occupancies. Most of the performance regulations for them were near the beginning of the Code... Section 714.1 covers emergency egress requirements.
Paul Sweet
Sawhorse
Egress windows have been required in sleeping rooms by the CABO 1 & 2 family code (which was the predecessor to the IRC) since the 1970s. I believe the IRC extended the requirement to all basements, even if they didn't have sleeping rooms, 10 or so years age.
However, NY might not have adopted these codes, or might have amended them. You should visit your building dept. and leaf through old codes.
However, NY might not have adopted these codes, or might have amended them. You should visit your building dept. and leaf through old codes.
Joe D
Registered User
I researched today in the green book and that is correct. Not trying to reinvent the wheel......just really wanted to find where the code section was that I could refer to when we run into an existing basement or bedroom without the proper emergency egress. Many times I need to verify I According to the green book,I can use 1984 as the year that the State addressed egress with regard to habitable space. Not all that concerned with village code since I can't really find a record of it. Thanks for the info
ADAguy
Registered User
"Green Book" in NY? in CA the Green Book is a public works guideline, not a building code.
Welcome to the area of code history.
Codes date back as early as the 1700's in some east coast cities, 1927 for UBC, as early as the 1890's in Los Angeles.
Do you know the year the building was built?
In some cases the base building may predate any locally adopted codes with different parts having been built under different codes.
I love showing inspectors hard copies of codes that were published before they were born (smiling) for just the reasons you are seeking.
Welcome to the area of code history.
Codes date back as early as the 1700's in some east coast cities, 1927 for UBC, as early as the 1890's in Los Angeles.
Do you know the year the building was built?
In some cases the base building may predate any locally adopted codes with different parts having been built under different codes.
I love showing inspectors hard copies of codes that were published before they were born (smiling) for just the reasons you are seeking.