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Labeled as Townhouse But Only Two Units

cboboggs said:
Mule, I think the developer and you are on the right track. Treat it as two single family dwellings with a zero lot line between the two and be done with it.
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Technically, doing so would require two independent one hour walls.

The townhouse provisions only apply to townhouses and that by definition requires three attached dwellings.

There is nothing in the code prohibiting a property line or lot line through the middle of a two family dwelling.

Just because some code official doesn't like it, doesn't mean it's wrong.
 
brudgers said:
Technically, doing so would require two independent one hour walls.The townhouse provisions only apply to townhouses and that by definition requires three attached dwellings.

There is nothing in the code prohibiting a property line or lot line through the middle of a two family dwelling.

Just because some code official doesn't like it, doesn't mean it's wrong.
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The plans show two independent one hour walls. Which will also require a bunch of inspections to verify compliance IF they want to sell as a townhouse.
 
It's a two family dwelling (otherwise know as a duplex around here) and they can built it with the townhouse requirements if they wish. It matters not at all if it is sold as two "townhouse" units or not as real estate language and code language don't necessarily line up anyway.
 
Good point yankee.

brudgers, it is not about like or dislike, some of us have to balance between zoning and building code. We have this exact situation here, and yes, they are built with two 1 hour walls and a lot line between the units.
 
Mule said:
The plans show two independent one hour walls. Which will also require a bunch of inspections to verify compliance IF they want to sell as a townhouse.
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What in the code requires a two family dwelling to have more than a one hour wall?
 
brudgers,

Would two walls side by side with drywall on one side of each units wall meet the requirement of a 1-hr wall for a duplex (2-units) not three (townhome) and then allow the lot to be split so to be sold separate. Your thoughts?

pc1
 
Pcinspector1 said:
brudgers,Would two walls side by side with drywall on one side of each units wall meet the requirement of a 1-hr wall for a duplex (2-units) not three (townhome) and then allow the lot to be split so to be sold separate. Your thoughts?

pc1
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I'm not brudgers, but,

A two family dwelling (a duplex if you will) can be split into condo units and be sold with simply separation per IRC two family dwellings. It does not need to be separation per Townhouse (3 or more connected dwelling units).
 
As far as the Res Code is concerned, it is a two-family, period.

2009 IRC: TOWNHOUSE. A single-family dwelling unit constructed in a group of three or more attached units in which each unit extends from foundation to roof and with a yard or public way on at least two sides.

2006 IRC: TOWNHOUSE. A single-family dwelling unit constructed in a group of three or more attached units in which each unit extends from foundation to roof and with open space on at least two sides.

Need I go back any farther?

Also from the 2006 IRC: R101.2 Scope. The provisions of the International Residential Code for One- and Two-family Dwellings shall apply to the construction, alteration, movement, enlargement, replacement, repair, equipment, use and occupancy, location, removal and demolition of detached one- and two-family dwellings and townhouses not more than three stories above grade plane in height with a separate means of egress and their accessory structures.
 
Pcinspector1 said:
brudgers,Would two walls side by side with drywall on one side of each units wall meet the requirement of a 1-hr wall for a duplex (2-units) not three (townhome) and then allow the lot to be split so to be sold separate. Your thoughts?

pc1
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Based on what I have read in the code, yes. [Assuming the wall assembly is a UL design or otherwise meets the fire rating.]

There is nothing that requires a two family dwelling to be under common ownership.

In addition, it could be sold fee simple. All that is required is the ground beneath each unit to be deeded...but I'm not a real estate attorney.
 
brudgers said:
What in the code requires a two family dwelling to have more than a one hour wall?
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The does not require more than a one hour wall. This is what the DP has specified. So I will inspect accordingly.
 
A two-family dwelling would be two connected dwelling units on a single lot. Two connected units on seperate lots constitutes two single family dwellings with 0' 0" lot line clearance. Different seperation requirements.
 
JBI said:
A two-family dwelling would be two connected dwelling units on a single lot. Two connected units on seperate lots constitutes two single family dwellings with 0' 0" lot line clearance. Different seperation requirements.
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What code section did you use to disqualify it as a two family dwelling?
 
Suggest to the developer that, since he can't call it a townhome, he should build a nice little greenspace, a vest pocket park, for the enjoyment of the townehome dwellers.
 
JBI said:
A two-family dwelling would be two connected dwelling units on a single lot. Two connected units on seperate lots constitutes two single family dwellings with 0' 0" lot line clearance. Different seperation requirements.
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Still I disagree, it is still a two family dwelling, not two single family dwellings. Two single family dwellings would need to be separated as is required for townhouses. It is a duplex "condo" building with two dwelling units (not two single family dwellings).

The separation provided as required for townhouses is what makes townhouses single family dwellings, not whether there is a lot line between them or not. The code does not speak to lot lines or lack thereof, or ownership in any way.
 
Is it possible that the 3 unit requirement is so that townhouses do not fall under the 1&2 family building code?
 
GHRoberts said:
Is it possible that the 3 unit requirement is so that townhouses do not fall under the 1&2 family building code?
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Mmmm , , , and that they are separated and laid-out as required so that they do not fall under apartment buildings?
 
GHRoberts said:
Is it possible that the 3 unit requirement is so that townhouses do not fall under the 1&2 family building code?
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Townhouses do fall under the One and Two Family code.
 
Section 202 defines townhome in the IRC as a single-family dwelling unit constructed in a group of 3 or more. Also see R317.2 for unit seperation.
 
From a building code point of view the only reason I could see for wanting a 2 unit "townhouse" would be to get to a less restrictive building code. But since townhouses are already use 1&2 family building code, I don't see any issue except for separation.

Perhaps the builder is trying to go from 2 hour rated walls to 1 hour. But I don't deal with such issues.
 
Whether 'Townhouses' on sperate lots or 'attached single family' on seperate lots, the key issue is the seperation. As a two-family it would require LESS protection, as it is seperating one unit from another, both being in common ownership. As attached single family units with zero lot line clearance EACH unit would need to meet a higher standard for seperation. As fire safety is a primary consideration of the Codes, I believe a higher standard is in order. Not quoting code sections as they have already been quoted.
 
A duplex is not required to be in common ownership, "Townhouses or attached single family" buildings do not have to be under separate ownership. The ownership is not a factor in the building code.
 
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