NFPA 101 just what is it?

[AegisFPE]

12,000 people dont fall down stairs, 12,000 people die when they fall down stairs. Stairs are by far the number one hazard in a SFR..... The number of accidents are much much higher.

That statistic is misleading for the subject case for multiple reasons:

1. The subject project already has 1 MOE stair which could be part of these statistics.

2. The offered statistics do not indicate the number of fatal falls attributed to spiral stairs (I am guessing this number would be minor, in part due to the limited number of spiral stairs compared to straight runs, and further due to the geometry where the victim is apt to fall into the spiral railing, which may tend to limit the falling person's velocity or distance, whereas the only thing to break your fall in a straight run is the bottom landing.)

3. It is not stated how many of the incidents occurred where an alternative stair was present. If I visit the subject project, I have the choice of going down the spiral stair or the compliant MOE. If I feel uncomfortable about traversing the spiral stairs, the MOE stairs are available to me, posing no greater risk than compliant MOE stairs in another home.

Therefore, with the addition of the spiral staircase, the minimum requirements for MOE stairs are still met such that the provisions of the code are satisfied.

 

[ICE]

I had a case years ago where the step rise was near 16" on an exterior staircase to a second floor balcony attached to a residence. The lady that lived there explained that she has a daycare business for toddlers and didn't want them to climb the stairs. I had to back my way down but I didn't back down.

You guys are too much with an open season approach. It's almost like a battle between code enforcement and stay out of my business. This is also the first time in ages that brudgers has had a posse.

 

[KZQuixote]

I see a framing hammer in your future. Or jail.

Dude! While I've never met Ben, I'm sure he has not a clue about the difference between a framing hammer and a finish hammer.

Ted

 

[KZQuixote]

Sometimes I wonder how on Earth I managed to buy into a group that included you two. Then I read some of my own stuff and I understand.Quote Originally Posted by KZQuixote View Post

I say now, I mean, I say now!

Can we have a moment of silence while the International Ice Code spontaneously generates a new code section requiring ladder blocking under non-bearing partitions.

Of course because this new section will be uniformly enforced across his concrete jungle, it'll be OK!

FogHorn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

One Eye you do get around don't you. We all pretty much agreed that there is no code for that. And could you get the code straight please. It is not International. It is Intergalactic. Your sister Texasbo named it that because she didn't want to be left out. Big surprise, that one. Y'all thought Scooter was a guy huh. I know...I was just as surprised as you are. Best part is, she wanted to say prophylactic code because she thinks my name is Dick. A head that big you would figure that the brain was a workhorse. What a disappointment; don't you agree?

Tiger

Hey Ice,

I testify at depositions and trials. I'd love to get the chance to call on you to expound on the Intergalactic Ice Code in front of a jury.

Foggy

 

[ICE]

Hey Ice,I testify at depositions and trials. I'd love to get the chance to call on you to expound on the Intergalactic Ice Code in front of a jury.

Foggy

Been sued a lot huh. It sounds like you act as your own attorney. That's predictable.

 

[texasbo]

Sometimes I wonder how on Earth I managed to buy into a group that included you two. Then I read some of my own stuff and I understand.Quote Originally Posted by KZQuixote View Post

I say now, I mean, I say now!

Can we have a moment of silence while the International Ice Code spontaneously generates a new code section requiring ladder blocking under non-bearing partitions.

Of course because this new section will be uniformly enforced across his concrete jungle, it'll be OK!

FogHorn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

One Eye you do get around don't you. We all pretty much agreed that there is no code for that. And could you get the code straight please. It is not International. It is Intergalactic. Your sister Texasbo named it that because she didn't want to be left out. Big surprise, that one. Y'all thought Scooter was a guy huh. I know...I was just as surprised as you are. Best part is, she wanted to say prophylactic code because she thinks my name is Dick. A head that big you would figure that the brain was a workhorse. What a disappointment; don't you agree?

Tiger

Wow. Although you have a history of posting some strange stuff after happy hour, I'm working my way backwards, and pardon me if I'm wrong, but this was posted 5 hours ago, and it's currently 11:21 here in the Lone Star State. That means it was posted at 4:21 Cali time. No problem, I guess; it's Friday after all. But typically I would expect at least half a day's drinkin' to work up a post that incoherent. So I'm assuming you just put in four today?

And no, I didn't think your name was Dick, but I did always assume, you know, given your fascination with sexual metaphors (as evidenced above), that your avatar was actually a Freudian projection of yourself. Well, you know what I mean. Don't feel humiliated though; the girls are laughing because it's dancing...

 

[texasbo]

Sometimes I wonder how on Earth I managed to buy into a group that included you two. Then I read some of my own stuff and I understand.

You're flattering yourself again.

 

[texasbo]

This is also the first time in ages that brudgers has had a posse.

Get out of here! Brudgers has had a posse for ages; you've been sniffing it as long as you've been on this forum.

 

[ICE]

That's the first comment I've gotten about the pencil. Even I think it's a bit annoying but gosh you've overreacted.

 

[brudgers]

I testify at depositions and trials.

That's hardly a surprise.

 

[permitguy]

That statistic is misleading for the subject case for multiple reasons

Respectfully, I think you're obscuring the larger point. Regardless of the idiosyncracies of the stat, it certainly establishes the need to regulate stairways for occupant safety. As long as we have had such regulations being enforced in this country, and as rare as spiral stairways are compared to traditional stairways, I'm willing to bet that the majority of these injuries occurred on non-spiral stairways that were compliant to some standard when they were built (anecdotal, I admit). What does that tell you about the spiral stair in the OP?

As an FPE, you're aware that we go to much greater lengths at much greater expense to protect people from the ravages of fire, even with much fewer deaths recorded each year. On that note, allowing a non-compliant stairway is akin to saying I don't need to extend sprinklers to the east wing of the building because the west wing already has them. Maybe there will never be a fire in the east wing, and maybe nobody will ever be injured on this non-compliant spiral stairway. That isn't really the point.

I keep hoping that this whole thread is a very elaborate joke, and tomorrow someone is going to post "April Fool's!" . . . **door opens for someone to quote this and criticize my level of knowledge as a joke**

 

[ICE]

I keep hoping that this whole thread is a very elaborate joke, and tomorrow someone is going to post "April Fool's!"

That someone would be brudgers.

 

[brudgers]

Respectfully, I think you're obscuring the larger point. Regardless of the idiosyncracies of the stat, it certainly establishes the need to regulate stairways for occupant safety. As long as we have had such regulations being enforced in this country, and as rare as spiral stairways are compared to traditional stairways, I'm willing to bet that the majority of these injuries occurred on non-spiral stairways that were compliant to some standard when they were built (anecdotal, I admit). What does that tell you about the spiral stair in the OP?

Nothing really relevant. What this thread shows is the inability of people to think about why the particular code requirements that are creating heartburn about THIS SET OF STAIRS, exist.

4" sphere - to keep children's heads from getting stuck - ears are like the barb on a fish hook.

Minimum width - to allow EMT evacuation.

Stairs are inherently dangerous.

Strict code compliance mitigates some of the danger, but not the most significant one,

the physical decline which accompanies old age.

It's mostly old people who die in falls.

Any change of level becomes an increasing hazard as we age.

And we are an increasingly aging population.

The proposed construction is not good design.

Not because of the particular configuration of the vertical access elements.

But because it is two stories.

Once you go there, you cannot make the dwelling very safe.

Short of an elevator.

Which is even more of a problematic as a "stairway" than what is under consideration.

 

[ICE]

Get out of here! Brudgers has had a posse for ages; you've been sniffing it as long as you've been on this forum.

Your lack of wit is exceeded only by your lack of class. I suppose it's time that I left you alone in order to spare the rest from further embarrassment. Yes I'll do that and include your brother too. Well.....maybe not right away.

Ya know, it's not too late for you two characters

Pay attention to the tricks in the video and see if you can't figure a way to imitate a normal psyche. Watch for subtle signs of success like not having to eat your lunch alone every day and remember that it's a long process with a lot of small steps so don't expect immediate results but rather, wait a few months and then ask the people that mean the most to you if they still find you boorish. You may have to expand the circle 'cause palm readers, prostitutes and parole officers are known to lie.

 

[KZQuixote]

Ice,

Your taunt to TBO "Your lack of wit is exceeded only by your lack of class..."

I would have sent this to you by Personal Message but you have forbidden them.

You are lacking in any measure of class!, you are are the *** boasting about the size of your head/dick!

Jeff, will you please reign this character in?

Bill

 

[ICE]

Ice,Your taunt to TBO "Your lack of wit is exceeded only by your lack of class..."

I would have sent this to you by Personal Message but you have forbidden them.

You are lacking in any measure of class!, you are are the *** boasting about the size of your head/dick!

Jeff, will you please reign this character in?

Bill

Well Ted, as usual, you've blundered. My mention of the "big head" was a reference to your sister Yosemite Samantha's huge melon. It's nearly as big as the rest of her body.

While it's admirable that you would stick up for a sibling, a plaintive cry for Jeff's help could be taken as a sign of surrender. I don't take prisoners and Jeff will tell you that boys will be boys....well except for Scooter...that's a case of gender reassignment gone awry.

I thought about sending this next part by PM but I just don't do that.

I'll forgive you Ted, if you will say that you are sorry. You really should try that. You'd be surprised how much better that can make you feel.

Take a deep breath....think of your happy place (If you are still welcome there).....and write it....."I'm sorry Tiger, please forgive me."

And Theodore, a cut and paste isn't from the heart.

Oh I almost forgot, I turned off the PM because of you. The last bomb you sent there was enough for me. Now that I've mentioned it, What's for lunch?

 

[texasbo]

Your lack of wit is exceeded only by your lack of class. Then a bunch of other rambling, and some reference to a Youtube video that nobody cares about.

Help me here; is this the kind of class I should aspire to, or some other kind of class?

http://www.inspectpa.com/forum/showthread.php?7949-Gas-logs&p=76802&viewfull=1#post76802

The example above was just the first one that came to mind, but I could post others (the ones you haven't deleted yet).Thanks in advance for your help.

 

[texasbo]

More classy insight, then:While it's admirable that you would stick up for a sibling, a plaintive cry for Jeff's help could be taken as a sign of surrender. I don't take prisoners and Jeff will tell you that boys will be boys....

You would know, I suppose. It wasn't that long ago that you went crying for Mommy like a little schoolgirl, only to be told to put your big girl panties on. It was pathetic, but it was funny too.

 

[ICE]

You would know, I suppose. It wasn't that long ago that you went crying for Mommy like a little schoolgirl, only to be told to put your big girl panties on. It was pathetic, but it was funny too.

I'd love to revisit that one so be a doll and take us back in time.