Occupant load ratio vs. chair count.

[Sifu]

Hypothetical situation: 2018 IBC/IPC

Nail salon, 14 pedicure stations, 6 nail stations. At max capacity their could be 20 people getting worked on, by presumably more than a few workers. So chair count plus workers would be 20+. OL by table would put the facility under 15 based on area.

The design OL using t1004.5 would be such that separate facilities and drinking fountains would not be required, but the "potential" for use by more than 15 would exceed those thresholds.

1004.6 might consider the pedicure stations as fixed, especially if plumbed, and the remainder of the space would then use the table, which would put them back over the exception thresholds. But what if not plumbed? Pedicure chairs wouldn't seem to be the intent of 1004.6 IMO. Would you consider the pedicure stations as fixed either way?

 

[steveray]

How does it work out with the 150 for B use? I find the IBC and using the Ch 10 OL for fixtures a little harsh and typically find a way to beat it down a bit...

 

[Yankee Chronicler]

I consider the question to be irrelevent. The basis of the occupant load (for egress, and then plumbing fixture count uses the same numbers) is the occupant load calculated per Table 1004.5 or the actual occupant load, whichever is greater. We seem to attract a LOT of nail salons in the town where I work. A nail salon is a business, and per Table 1004.5 a business occupant load is calculated on gross square foot area. It doesn't matter if the pedicure chairs are fixed or movable (I've never seen one that wasn't fixed -- they have ventilation and plumbing built in, so they are not portable).

If you count work stations and multiply by two (one station = one client and one technician) plus one or two managerial staff plus chairs for waiting, you probably won't exceed the number based on the table.

When applying the one person per 150 square feet rule, you can deduct from the floor area only the items listed in the IBC definition for Gross Floor Area:

[BE] FLOOR AREA, GROSS. The floor area within the
inside perimeter of the exterior walls of the building under
consideration, exclusive of vent shafts and courts, without
deduction for corridors, stairways, ramps, closets, the thickness
of interior walls, columns or other features. The floor
area of a building, or portion thereof, not provided with
surrounding exterior walls shall be the usable area under the
horizontal projection of the roof or floor above. The gross
floor area shall not include shafts with no openings or interior
courts.

 

[Yankee Chronicler]

1004.6 might consider the pedicure stations as fixed, especially if plumbed, and the remainder of the space would then use the table, which would put them back over the exception thresholds. But what if not plumbed? Pedicure chairs wouldn't seem to be the intent of 1004.6 IMO. Would you consider the pedicure stations as fixed either way?

How would the IBC allow you to deduct for the pedicure stations in a B occupancy? If you're going to do that, why not also deduct the manicure stations and the reception desk.

 

[mtlogcabin]

2018 IBC
1004.5 Areas without fixed seating.
The number of occupants shall be computed at the rate of one occupant per unit of area as prescribed in Table 1004.5. For areas without fixed seating, the occupant load shall be not less than that number determined by dividing the floor area under consideration by the occupant load factor assigned to the function of the space as set forth in Table 1004.5. Where an intended function is not listed in Table 1004.5, the building official shall establish a function based on a listed function that most nearly resembles the intended function.

Exception: Where approved by the building official, the actual number of occupants for whom each occupied space, floor or building is designed, although less than those determined by calculation, shall be permitted to be used in the determination of the design occupant load.

 

[Sifu]

I just asked my wife....I get about 5 minutes before her eyes start to glass over. I asked how many customers could be worked on while getting a pedicure or nails done. She said she thinks maximum of 3 for each. So from a practical standpoint, at absolute maximum, they could have 20 customers, and 3 or 4 workers. From a code standpoint, they could be as low as 13 (using area only from t1004.5), or as high as 31 (using 20 fixed seats with the remainder as area). This would have considerate implication's on the space.

I did a beauty salon recently where the chairs were not plumbed, but had the required exhaust outlet. Does the exhaust make them fixed? I did another with plumbed chairs (but no exhaust on first comments). To me they are fixed. So if I use 1004.6 and say 1 each for the chairs, and then cut out the area for the chairs from the gross area, use 150/per for the remaining area, I get > 15, but maybe <25. If the manicure chairs are not fixed, but they can't move without relocating the exhaust inlet, are they fixed? The plumbing would seem to meet "secured in place" for the definition of fixed seating, but not sure an exhaust inlet would.

This hypothetical because they aren't trying to assert a lower OL, actually higher than they would need to. It just got me thinking about it, and their response to my missing drinking fountain and missing source capture exhaust system comments.

 

[steveray]

To me...We are not really allowed to have separate facilities (for single users) anymore so that is moot...As far as the drinking fountain, it is more of a "spa" type atmosphere so Shirley they will get them a cup of water when asked.....

 

[Sifu]

They are providing separate facilities, not an issue. The are not providing DF's, which is.

1004.6 says to count the fixed seats, then add the rest of the space by area. There is no way to hit 15, but it is possible that they could come back with 25 or fewer 25 to eliminate a toilet room to offset the space and cost of the required DF.

While I understand the idea that someone could get them a cup of water, the code does not. If they have 17 occupants, CBO probably gives it a pass. If they have 31, he probably does not.

No waiting area, just a reception desk, space includes a break room, toilet rooms, a bar (no seats, just standers I guess) and a facial room with 3 tables. If I pull out the space occupied by the pedicure stations, and some (undefined) area that can only be occupied by the worker, and calculate everything else at 1/150, they might get down to 25. But if I pull out the manicure stations, the will be at 31. Multiple scenarios for how this would end up, but since they calculated to OL using a 1/50sf² I have no issue with it. At least until they respond.

 

[steveray]

They are providing separate facilities, not an issue. The are not providing DF's, which is.

1004.6 says to count the fixed seats, then add the rest of the space by area. There is no way to hit 15, but it is possible that they could come back with 25 or fewer 25 to eliminate a toilet room to offset the space and cost of the required DF.

While I understand the idea that someone could get them a cup of water, the code does not. If they have 17 occupants, CBO probably gives it a pass. If they have 31, he probably does not.

No waiting area, just a reception desk, space includes a break room, toilet rooms, a bar (no seats, just standers I guess) and a facial room with 3 tables. If I pull out the space occupied by the pedicure stations, and some (undefined) area that can only be occupied by the worker, and calculate everything else at 1/150, they might get down to 25. But if I pull out the manicure stations, the will be at 31. Multiple scenarios for how this would end up, but since they calculated to OL using a 1/50sf² I have no issue with it. At least until they respond.

Agreed....if it is close, it is easy to make it happen, and I do....

 

[Sifu]

To me...We are not really allowed to have separate facilities (for single users) anymore so that is moot...

Are you allowing a reduction in the number of fixtures since you don't allow (require) separate facilities?

 

[Yankee Chronicler]

I just asked my wife....I get about 5 minutes before her eyes start to glass over. I asked how many customers could be worked on while getting a pedicure or nails done. She said she thinks maximum of 3 for each. So from a practical standpoint, at absolute maximum, they could have 20 customers, and 3 or 4 workers. From a code standpoint, they could be as low as 13 (using area only from t1004.5), or as high as 31 (using 20 fixed seats with the remainder as area). This would have considerate implication's on the space.

I did a beauty salon recently where the chairs were not plumbed, but had the required exhaust outlet. Does the exhaust make them fixed? I did another with plumbed chairs (but no exhaust on first comments). To me they are fixed. So if I use 1004.6 and say 1 each for the chairs, and then cut out the area for the chairs from the gross area, use 150/per for the remaining area, I get > 15, but maybe <25. If the manicure chairs are not fixed, but they can't move without relocating the exhaust inlet, are they fixed? The plumbing would seem to meet "secured in place" for the definition of fixed seating, but not sure an exhaust inlet would.

This hypothetical because they aren't trying to assert a lower OL, actually higher than they would need to. It just got me thinking about it, and their response to my missing drinking fountain and missing source capture exhaust system comments.

It doesn't matter if an exhaust duct makes a station fixed, because the occupancy classification is B, and the calculation per the table is based on gross floor area, not net area. For gross floor area, the only things you deduct are vent shafts and courts. You can deduct for fixed equipment only for occupancies that use net floor area. Also, you can't figure 1 occupant for each chair or station. Each station has a client and a technician, so each chair or station is 2 occupant.

If they want to go by an actual occupant load less than the calculated load, based on number of stations, they need to request that. We had a salon with 8 manicure stations and 5 pedicure stations tell us they would never have more than 10 people plus one manager in the place. We didn't buy it. We had a hair salon with 30 chairs, plus a "Styling" area with 23 styling stations, tell us there would never be more than 8 or 10 customers in the salon at any time. Really? Then why are you providing 53 stations? Even discounting the possibility of customers seated in the waiting area, there's a big difference between 20 occupants and 106 occupants.

 

[steveray]

Are you allowing a reduction in the number of fixtures since you don't allow (require) separate facilities?

If they get to 25 its one....

 

[Sifu]

1004.6 would seem to suggest otherwise. A fixed seat is defined. A plumbed pedicure station would seem to fit the definition. 1004.6 says the OL shall be determined by the number of fixed seats and the area that doesn't contain the fixed seats shall be determined by the area per t1004.5, and added to the number of people based on the fixed seats. So if the area occupied by the fixed seats is 300sf² and contains 14 fixed seats, the OL is increased by 12 (300/150=2, then add 14).

If one does not consider 1004.6 Fixed Seating as applicable to a pedicure chair, then you could have an OL calculated at less than what would be likely. If one does consider it applicable, then the code would seem to calculate the number at something much closer to reality, and much closer to what they propose, even if their methodology is questionable.

 

[Tim Mailloux]

For situations like this I look at it by calculation, and also by counting buts in seats, and then go with the more restrictive number.

 

[Yankee Chronicler]

1004.6 would seem to suggest otherwise. A fixed seat is defined. A plumbed pedicure station would seem to fit the definition. 1004.6 says the OL shall be determined by the number of fixed seats and the area that doesn't contain the fixed seats shall be determined by the area per t1004.5, and added to the number of people based on the fixed seats. So if the area occupied by the fixed seats is 300sf² and contains 14 fixed seats, the OL is increased by 12 (300/150=2, then add 14).

If one does not consider 1004.6 Fixed Seating as applicable to a pedicure chair, then you could have an OL calculated at less than what would be likely. If one does consider it applicable, then the code would seem to calculate the number at something much closer to reality, and much closer to what they propose, even if their methodology is questionable.

I guess as the AHJ you could determine that 1004.6 applies. The Commentary suggests that 1004.6 is intended to apply to assembly occupancies, not businesses.

The occupant load in an area with fixed seats is readily
determined. In spaces with a combination of fixed and
loose seating, the occupant load is determined by a
combination of the occupant density number from
Table 1004.5 and a count of the fixed seats.

For bleachers, booths and other seating facilities
without dividing arms, the occupant load is simply
based on the number of people that can be accommodated
in the length of the seat. Measured at the hips,
an average person occupies about 18 inches (457
mm) on a bench. In a booth, additional space is necessary
for “elbow room” while eating. In a circular or
curved booth or bench, the measurement should be
taken just a few inches from the back of the seat,
which is where a person’s hips would be located (see
Commentary Figure 1004.6).

Some assembly spaces may have areas for standing
or waiting. For example, some large sports stadiums
have “standing room only” areas used for sell-out
games. The Globe Theater in England has standing
room in an area at the front of the theater. This section
is not intended to assign an occupant load to the typical
circulation aisles in an assembly space. Occupant
load for wheelchair spaces should be based on the
number of wheelchairs and companion seats that the
space was designed for. As specified in Section
1004.4, if the wheelchair spaces may also be utilized
for standing space or removable seating, the occupant
load must be determined by the worst-case scenario.

 

[Sifu]

I guess as the AHJ you could determine that 1004.6 applies. The Commentary suggests that 1004.6 is intended to apply to assembly occupancies, not businesses.

I agree, I have only ever considered it with assembly spaces, but this is a new consideration for me. This facility would have 20 fixed seats (if the manicure stations count) presumably all of which they would like to fill, with calculated OL of 13 if we don't consider this section as applicable. So that is the basis for my query.

 

[bill1952]

I agree, I don't believe "fixed seating" was ever intended to apply to other than assembly. Glad to see I'm not alone. The OL table refers only to assembly with or without fixed seating.

 

[Yankee Chronicler]

I agree, I have only ever considered it with assembly spaces, but this is a new consideration for me. This facility would have 20 fixed seats (if the manicure stations count) presumably all of which they would like to fill, with calculated OL of 13 if we don't consider this section as applicable. So that is the basis for my query.

How many stations (manicure and pedicure)? Are you saying 7.5 work stations? How do you arrive at 13 total occupants? You said 14 manicure stations and 6 pedicure stations. To me, that's 20 stations x 2 = 40 occupents. (Plus the manager, receptionsist, and waiting area.)

Every single salon we have reviewed plans for (hair salon, nail salon, nail salon w/ pedicure) has absolutely maintained that they will NEVER EVER have all the stations occupied at once. I have almost never looked into a nail salon during the busy time of the day and NOT seen all stations occupied, with clients, and with more people waiting in the reception area.

These people are out to make a buck. They wouldn't spend the money it costs to install these work stations, with their dedicated exhaust systems, if they planned to have half (or more) of them sit idle. They are classified as B occupancies, which uses gross floor area. I start by calculating the occupant load based on Table 1004.5. Then I count the work stations, multiply by two, and then add in few more to account for a manager, a receptionist, and a couple/few people waiting in the reception area. Whichever number is greater prevails.

I'm not saying the owners are liars, just that they seem to be truth-impaired.

 

[Sifu]

14 pedicure, 6 manicure, 3 facial tables. The 13 comes from the OL as calculated by sf² only (1899/150). This would not be acceptable, but may be their response. The OL I come up with is 31, which is 20 for the pedicure and manicure station, plus 11 for the remainder of the area not occupied by the fixed chairs. I don't know how you account for the number of employees except by using the table ratios for the area not occupied by the fixed chairs, which is what 1004.6 tells me to do. The occupant load they come up with is 38, which they come up with by using a 1/50 ratio. I don't know where they come up with a 1/50 ratio unless they worked backwards from the OL they think they should have and came up with it. Right now the OL is not an issue, but their response to comments might prompt them to come back with an OL based on 1/150, so they can avoid providing a drinking fountain. They are not proposing that right now, which is why it is hypothetical, but I suspect their tune may change so I am anticipating their response so I can be prepared for the phone call. So they aren't stretching the truth just yet.

Their proposed OL would account for every chair being occupied, plus 18 employees. Closer to the 1 employee per chair you come up with. The OL I come up with is every chair filled plus 11 employees, which is closer to what my mani/pedi expert (wife) says is more likely.

My experience, which is very limited since I don't use these facilities is that the manager, receptionist, and manicurists are all the same people and would be covered by the table ratio of 1/150

We'll see what they say.

I am curious how you would calculate the OL for a barber shop. Do you consider every station a fixed chair, and use an every chair filled plus an employee at every chair? Same for a shampoo station? I agree they might love the idea of every chair filled, but I am not sure that is how it would work out. I also don't use barbers, so I can't say for sure.

 

[Yankee Chronicler]

14 pedicure, 6 manicure, 3 facial tables. The 13 comes from the OL as calculated by sf² only (1899/150). This would not be acceptable, but may be their response. The OL I come up with is 31, which is 20 for the pedicure and manicure station, plus 11 for the remainder of the area not occupied by the fixed chairs. I don't know how you account for the number of employees except by using the table ratios for the area not occupied by the fixed chairs, which is what 1004.6 tells me to do. The occupant load they come up with is 38, which they come up with by using a 1/50 ratio. I don't know where they come up with a 1/50 ratio unless they worked backwards from the OL they think they should have and came up with it. Right now the OL is not an issue, but their response to comments might prompt them to come back with an OL based on 1/150, so they can avoid providing a drinking fountain. They are not proposing that right now, which is why it is hypothetical, but I suspect their tune may change so I am anticipating their response so I can be prepared for the phone call. So they aren't stretching the truth just yet.

There's no exception for drinking fountains in B occupancies. They need at least one. If the occupant load is 101 or more, they need two.

You can't deduct any floor area for the "fixed" pedicure stations before applying the gross floor area ratio. Gross means gross -- the only deductions are for vent shafts and courts. You are mixing approaches where the code doesn't allow you to mix approaches.

Their proposed OL would account for every chair being occupied, plus 18 employees. Closer to the 1 employee per chair you come up with. The OL I come up with is every chair filled plus 11 employees, which is closer to what my mani/pedi expert (wife) says is more likely.

I don't see how it's allowable to figure clients in every chair but not assign a technician to every client. We are supposed to calculate occupant load for the highest possible number, not an average.

My experience, which is very limited since I don't use these facilities is that the manager, receptionist, and manicurists are all the same people and would be covered by the table ratio of 1/150

No. As I said, we have a LOT of these salons in town. They generally have at least one manager and a receptionist/cashier in addition to the technicians.

I am curious how you would calculate the OL for a barber shop. Do you consider every station a fixed chair, and use an every chair filled plus an employee at every chair? Same for a shampoo station? I agree they might love the idea of every chair filled, but I am not sure that is how it would work out. I also don't use barbers, so I can't say for sure.

I haven't used barber shops for a number of years, since my wife started doing my haircuts at home, so my experience isn't current. The barber shop I used to go to had nine chairs and nine barbers. Unless a barber was on vacation, all chairs had a barber, and generally all chairs were filled and there were at least three or four people waiting.

These stations cost money. They don't spend the money installing them just to watch them sitting vacant.

 

[Sifu]

The IPC 410.2 allows any occupancy with an OL < 16 to not have a drinking fountain. The IBC doesn't mandate that there must be one worker for every chair as far as I know. I disagree that I am mixing or misusing the codes. 1004.6 tells us to use the fixed seats, then use the table for the rest. I don't think you double count the area taken up by the fixed seats, but if I am wrong it would add a few occupants. Not going to matter in this case.

If they come back with flat 1/150, resulting in an OL less than 15, and no drinking fountain I would cite 1004.6, t1004.5 and IPC t403.1. I don't know a citation for a worker for every chair.

This conversation is bringing up things I have not considered. How do you do a dentists office? Most procedure rooms are small, and by table ratio, would calculate at 1 or less. But there is a fixed chair, and a dentist, often a dental assistant. Table puts the room at less than 1, fixed chair and a worker or two puts it at 3. I have never calculated a dental office that way, but maybe I have never done it correctly.

 

[mtlogcabin]

There's no exception for drinking fountains in B occupancies. They need at least one.

IPC 2018

DRINKING FOUNTAIN (SEE SECTION 410)

410.2 Small occupancies.
Drinking fountains shall not be required for an occupant load of 15 or fewer.