Overlapping clear floor space

[nealderidder]

Picture a typical commercial mens/womens bathroom back to back (attached). A drinking fountain (DF) is often provided in a vestibule at the entry into the bathrooms between the two doors. I understand the swing of the door can't encroach on the DF clear floor space but can the clear floor space for the door overlap with the clear floor space of the DF? I think in general clear floor spaces can overlap but maybe I'm missing something? Also wondering about 11B 602.9 (CBC jurisdiction). Are these DF "encroaching into pedestrian way"?

Thanks for any input!

 

[arwat23]

Yes, the clear floor space for a fixture and door maneuvering space can overlap.

Regarding 11B-602.9, I think the way you have it drawn is not compliant with this section. "Pedestrian Way" isn't extremely well defined (no examples given to rule anything out), but I would argue that since pedestrians need to pass close to the drinking fountain to get to the restroom doors, and the door maneuvering clearance extends past the front of the DF, the location the drinking fountain is at is a pedestrian way. I would argue that some sort of protection is needed.

 

[nealderidder]

Yes, the clear floor space for a fixture and door maneuvering space can overlap.

Regarding 11B-602.9, I think the way you have it drawn is not compliant with this section. "Pedestrian Way" isn't extremely well defined (no examples given to rule anything out), but I would argue that since pedestrians need to pass close to the drinking fountain to get to the restroom doors, and the door maneuvering clearance extends past the front of the DF, the location the drinking fountain is at is a pedestrian way. I would argue that some sort of protection is needed.

I hear you. I think we've done this a few times in this jurisdiction and haven't been called on it. But someone vision impaired could certainly walk out the door and right into the DF.

 

[cjshumate]

Picture a typical commercial mens/womens bathroom back to back (attached). A drinking fountain (DF) is often provided in a vestibule at the entry into the bathrooms between the two doors. I understand the swing of the door can't encroach on the DF clear floor space but can the clear floor space for the door overlap with the clear floor space of the DF? I think in general clear floor spaces can overlap but maybe I'm missing something? Also wondering about 11B 602.9 (CBC jurisdiction). Are these DF "encroaching into pedestrian way"?

Thanks for any input!

I believe you have your maneuvering clearance shown incorrectly on the push side of the door. You should be looking at the maneuvering clearance for hinge approach on push side of door, which is 42" wide and extends 22" past the hinge side of door. Perhaps those clearances don't even overlap?

 

[nealderidder]

I believe you have your maneuvering clearance shown incorrectly on the push side of the door. You should be looking at the maneuvering clearance for hinge approach on push side of door, which is 42" wide and extends 22" past the hinge side of door. Perhaps those clearances don't even overlap?

Point taken, we default to front approaches because those clearances are drawn in the door block! But this door will have a closer so it's the same 48" depth required for front approach or hinge approach and doesn't help in this instance.

 

[cjshumate]

Point taken, we default to front approaches because those clearances are drawn in the door block! But this door will have a closer so it's the same 48" depth required for front approach or hinge approach and doesn't help in this instance.

Yes, I assumed you'd have a closer BUT you won't have a latch, right? You only increase the maneuvering clearance if you have both a closer and a latch.

 

[nealderidder]

Yes, I assumed you'd have a closer BUT you won't have a latch, right? You only increase the maneuvering clearance if you have both a closer and a latch.

Indeed you are correct, no latch. Thanks!