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Paper Towel Dispenser in WC Clear Space?

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Mech

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Eastern PA
ANSI A117.1 - 2009

Section 604.3.3 Clearance Overlap. The required clearance around the water closet shall be permitted to overlap the water closet, associated grab bars, paper dispensers, sanitary napkin receptacles, coat hooks, shelves, accessible routes, clear floor space at other fixtures and the turning space. No other fixtures or obstructions shall be with the required water closet clearance.

Does the section above allow paper towel dispensers or only toilet paper dispensers?

I have always kept my designs to toilet paper only.
 
"Paper dispensers"

I'd include paper towel dispensers in the exception, however am not sure how one would mount one where it did not interfere with the grab bars.

Any example floor plans?
 
I would say that the paper towel dispenser is outside of the toilet area. I have not seen a universal ADA drawing with paper towels inside the toilet area.

But I believe the "paper cowboy hats" are allowed inside the toilet area.
 
consider a paper towel dispenser mounted on the rear wall between the WC & the side of the Lav, that projects more than 4" but the height of its dispensing opening is less than 40" but higher than 27" ?
 
747336_p
Paper cowboy hats, usually behind and above the toilet
 
Isn't 604.3.3 applicable to all the elements listed permitted to have their clear floor space to overlap in accordance with the following provisions?

operable part: A component of an element used to insert or withdraw objects, or to activate, deactivate, or adjust the element.

301.2 Overlap. Unless otherwise specified, clear floor spaces, clearances at fixtures, maneuvering clearances at doors, and turning spaces shall be permitted to overlap.

309 Operable Parts

309.1 General. Operable parts required to be accessible shall comply with Section 309.

309.2 Clear Floor Space. A clear floor space complying with Section 305 shall be provided.

For the toilet paper dispenser to fall within the reach range while disposed, the applicable sections would be 604.7 & 604.11.7

604.7 Dispensers. Toilet paper dispensers shall comply with Section 309.4. Where the dispenser is located above the grab bar, the outlet of the dispenser shall be located within an area 24 inches minimum and 36 inches maximum from the rear wall. Where the dispenser is located below the grab bar, the outlet of the dispenser shall be located within an area 24 inches minimum and 42 inches maximum from the rear wall. The outlet of the dispenser shall be located 18 inches minimum and 48 inches maximum above the floor. Dispensers shall comply with Section 609.3. Dispensers shall not be of a type that control delivery, or do not allow continuous paper flow.
 
So Francis, a roll of toilet paper cannot be on the toilet tank lid, what about the can of deodorant spray, I suppose that can't be on the lid either...Nuts!:eek:

Mech said:
Does the section above allow paper towel dispensers or only toilet paper dispensers?
Click to expand...

Would't want paper towels (Brawny) going down the loo!
 
Pcinspector1 said:
So Francis, a roll of toilet paper cannot be on the toilet tank lid, what about the can of deodorant spray, I suppose that can't be on the lid either...Nuts!:eek:
Click to expand...

"Shelves" are an allowed component. BTW, that includes a baby changing table.
The code is silent-but-deadly (couldn't resist!) on the subject of deodorant cans or whatever else gets to sit on the shelf.
Likewise, it allows coat hooks, but is silent on the coats themselves.
I presume that means this portion of the code is concerned primarily about permanently affixed components.
 
Pcinspector1 said:
747336_p
Paper cowboy hats, usually behind and above the toilet
Click to expand...
I heard of a study recently that found more bacteria on the toilet seat covers than on the toilet seats themselves. Toilet seats are designed and constructed out of material that restricts bacteria. Paper on the other hand, is great at trapping and giving them food to grow.
 
But can you allow a bookcase, sanitary napkin receptacle on the floor or self supporting toilet paper holder next to the WC? The code doesn't seem to require if this stuff is mounted on the wall or not.
 
Commentary; "It is not the intent of this section to prohibit these items within the toilet room or stall, but rather to make sure that these items are located so that they do not block access to the water closet within the room or stall."

Also refer to section 609.3 for clearances above a below grab bars.
 
Do they interfere with the clear floor space for a WC? They might be located between the WC and a wall but could then be hard to use.
Given that they are not "fixed elements" they might be seen as "maintaince " items similar to trash receptacles that obstruct mobility.
 
Francis Vineyard said:
Also refer to section 609.3 for clearances above a below grab bars.
Click to expand...

These items that I mentioned would not be above or below the grab bar but in front of it.

ADAguy said:
Given that they are not "fixed elements" they might be seen as "maintaince " items similar to trash receptacles that obstruct mobility
Click to expand...

But what if they were fixed, it looks like the code would allow it.
 
I mean the code seems to be ok with a bolted down (fixed) bookcase (shelving), sanitary napkin receptacle or self supporting toilet paper holder anywhere in the required WC clear space as long it complies with section 609.3 for clearances above a below grab bars. I'm thinking that they could away from the walls and in the middle of the required clear space.
 
Ok let's say 30" from open side of WC and 30" from the wall that is behind the WC is a self supporting toilet paper dispenser or a self supporting shelf attached to the floor. It looks like the code is ok with this.The code does not say that the shelf or anything else that it allows per section 604.3.2 in this space needs to be on the wall.
 
If attached to the floor how far does it project out from the face of the wall? Appears to be an obstruction.
 
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