Raised Booth in Restaurant

[Yikes]

Mark, I would challenge you on something that I'm reading into your post:
The requirement for "dispersal" is a geographic one: don't creat a wheelchair ghetto. However, "dispersal"does not necessarily imply that each type (not just location) of dining surface must be accessible.

For example, I could have an 80'x80' square dining room, no windows, with elevated booths on all perimeter walls. If I put accessible seating all on the main floor but scattered towards the north, south, east, and west walls, I have successfully dispersed the accessible seating, even though it isn't in an elevated booth.

 

[fj80]

Mark, I would challenge you on something that I'm reading into your post:
The requirement for "dispersal" is a geographic one: don't creat a wheelchair ghetto. However, "dispersal"does not necessarily imply that each type (not just location) of dining surface must be accessible.

For example, I could have an 80'x80' square dining room, no windows, with elevated booths on all perimeter walls. If I put accessible seating all on the main floor but scattered towards the north, south, east, and west walls, I have successfully dispersed the accessible seating, even though it isn't in an elevated booth.

I think that's the crux of the issue: Is it 5% of the total dining surfaces, or 5% of each type? I'm not saying I'm right, I just think the ADA wording is unclear and does not say it's 5% of each type.

 

[ADAguy]

Again, if unsure then ask Access Board for a clarification.

 

[mark handler]

If you have raised windo seats, you better have accessible seating as well.

 

[fj80]

I spoke to the Access Board and they said essentially the same thing Mark Handler and some others have said here- although the ADA text doesn't use the word "type" it's their intention that 5% of each type of seating be accessible.

 

[mark handler]

What they have told me in the past is to stop analyzing each word and design base on the intent.

 

[tmurray]

What they have told me in the past is to stop analyzing each word and design base on the intent.

Are they enforcing laws based on intent? While I agree with designing to the intent of the law from an professional ethics standpoint, if the law is not clear in its requirements it should be clarified so the true intent can be enforced through the court system. As it stands, good designers following the intent of the law will be penalized.

 

[JBI]

If more designers, owners and (yikes!) attorneys would stop and think "what if I were disabled?" before they make a decision, there'd likely be fewer lawsuits and more compliant buildings and facilities...

 

[Francis Vineyard]

Are they enforcing laws based on intent? While I agree with designing to the intent of the law from an professional ethics standpoint, if the law is not clear in its requirements it should be clarified so the true intent can be enforced through the court system. As it stands, good designers following the intent of the law will be penalized.

In the US of A a special prosecutor can perceive it as a Hate Crime; where it presumes criminal intent.

Although "the Congress apparently did not think that disabled people compromised [sic] a 'high risk' group in relation to interpersonal violence" when it first contemplated hate crime legislation, disability was later added to federal hate crime law via the reauthorization of the Hate Crime Statistics Act

Examining the Boundaries of Hate Crime Law: Disabilities and the Dilemma of Difference

 

[mark handler]

they enforcing laws based on intent? While I agree with designing to the intent of the law from an professional ethics standpoint, if the law is not clear in its requirements it should be clarified so the true intent can be enforced through the court system. As it stands, good designers following the intent of the law will be penalized.

The DOJ typically does not enforce the small Instances or infractions, those are done by individuals and lawyers. The DOJ goes after the big guys.

 

[ADAguy]

9/10s of the law deals with "intent" specifics, or lack there of. Defense atty's rely on "specific" language vs intent.
FJ, yours is a best practices/standard of care issue; what does your E & O carrier recommend?

 

[fj80]

I've already decided to add at least 5% accessible booths to the design, dispersed throughout the space. Case closed. Fairly easy solution to work into the facility.

 

[ADAguy]

Thumbs up to you!

 

[Mr. Inspector]

Why does not a bar need to follow 2012 IBC 1109.12.3. Point of sale and service counters. Where counters are provided for sales or distribution of goods and serves, at least one each type provided shall be accessible.

Don't they distribute goods and services when they give you a beer or food and provide sales when you pay for it?

 

[ADAguy]

Difference between distribution and consumption, you transfer at one and consume at the other.