Remodel job IEBC

[jar546]

Existing minimart is doing some renovating inside such as adding lighting to coolers, taking a small employee bathroom and creating one public unisex accessible bathroom, new counters, new store layout, lighting, etc. I have a fit out set of prints with a very detailed breakdown of occupancy load which they are showing as 53. It is an M classification (obviously).

Now that they are renovating and enlarging 1 bathroom I see no way around the requirement for 2 bathrooms based on occupancy load. Why could they not just keep this under 50 :shock:

 

[north star]

Re: Remodel job IEBC

Jeff,

Tell `em that they will have to put in that 2nd restroom and see if their occupant

load doesn't decrease somehow, ...magically!

 

[georgia plans exam]

Re: Remodel job IEBC

We don’t use the IEBC here so I am not familiar with it but, does it contain anything similar to 2006 IBC Section 3410.2.4 “An existing building or portion thereof, which does not comply with the requirements of this code for new construction, shall not be altered or repaired in such a manner that results in the building being less safe or sanitary than such building is currently.”?

I mean, if they are improving a small employee bathroom to make it accessible and available to the public, I’m not sure I would be inclined to require separate facilities.

GPE

 

[north star]

Re: Remodel job IEBC

GPE,

There was / is a current discussion on this very topic over in the Commercial Plumbing

Section on this forum:

http://inspectpa.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=453

Seems like 50 is the magic number in the Mercantile type occupancies,

plus the plans Jeff mentioned even gave a breakdown of the occupant

load.

From the `06 IEBC, Section 302.9:

"Minor additions, alterations, renovations and repairs to existing installations

shall meet the provisions for new construction, unless such work is done in the

same manner and arrangement as was the existing system, is not hazardous and

is approved."

 

[mtlogcabin]

Re: Remodel job IEBC

Agree with north star I believe they can find away to get it below 50. I count the coolers and such as storage not retail. I only use the gross floor area of retail space at 30 sq ft per person not other areas.

 

[georgia plans exam]

Re: Remodel job IEBC

north star,

in the thread that you reference, the OP indicates that the project is a change in use. Assuming that that is a change of the occupancy classification, I agree that a second bathroom would be required per Section 3406.1.

However, in this case there is not a change in occupancy classification and I would not require a second bathroom.

Remember, I am using Chapter 34 and not the IEBC so, in jar's case, the result may be different.

GPE

 

[JBI]

Re: Remodel job IEBC

Chapter 34 should give almost identical answers to the EBC.

NYS used to use Chapter 34 in conjunction with an Appendix ('K' in our 2002 code) prior to adopting a modifed EBC. Sections 3401 - 3409 were 'reserved' and referenced the appendix (where the 'meat & potatoes' were). 3410, the alternative provisions, were all there.

The EBC basically took chapter 34 (and in our case the appendix), combined them into a seperate document and 'rearranged them for clarity' of course.

Still a nightmare, it just moved a few blocks away from Elm Street.

 

[north star]

Re: Remodel job IEBC

GPE,

Agreed! The OP isn't a change of use, ...it is still a minimart.

Section 3410.2.4 - Alterations and repairs:

"An existing building or portion thereof, which does not comply with the requirements

of this code for new construction, shall not be altered or repaired in such manner that

results in the building being less safe or sanitary than such building is currently!"

By the owner complying with 3409.9.4 - Toilet and bathing facilities, no 2nd restroom

would be required, if it were in your location. Jeff did not mention if he was adhering

to the IEBC or not. I just " ass "-umed that he was.

 

[jar546]

Re: Remodel job IEBC

I would like to bump this up for more feedback and to give an update.

I listed quite a few items on my plan review letter, including the need for a 2nd bathroom along with the fact that the proposed ADA compliant bathroom was no ADA compliant per ANSI 117.1 that we use in PA. I got a new PDF of the plans (just one page) showing a larger SINGLE bathroom. They did not address the 2nd bathroom. DUH? I guess if they ignore it, it will go away.

 

[JBI]

Re: Remodel job IEBC

Level 2 Alterations shall comply with (among other things) Chap 7 of the EBC.

SECTION 710 PLUMBING

710.1 Minimum fixtures.

Where the occupant load of the story is increased by more than 20 percent, plumbing fixtures for the story shall be provided in quantities specified in the International Plumbing Code based on the increased occupant load.

Now the question becomes... Have they increased the Occ Load by more than 20%?

 

[north star]

Re: Remodel job IEBC

John,

A 20% increase in the occ. load would be 30 sq. ft. per person x [ Jeff's stated 53 occ. load ] = 53 x 0.20 =

10.6 occupants. Rounding up to 11 occupants would equal [ approximately ] 11 x 30 sq. ft. = 330 sq. ft.

increase in floor area. Me thinks that this is correct.

Jeff,

We are assuming that the minimart in question is under the IEBC, ...yes? :?

 

[jar546]

Re: Remodel job IEBC

Yes, they did delcare the IEBC vs Chapter 34 of the IBC.

 

[JBI]

Re: Remodel job IEBC

Any response from them yet?

 

[jar546]

Re: Remodel job IEBC

Nope, no response. We will see.