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Single family dwelling with daycare

J

jtom

Sawhorse
Joined
Dec 21, 2012
Messages
43
Location
Va.
We have an existing 2-story building with 2700 sg ft on top floor and 2300 sq ft on bottom.In Va. we classify sfd as R-5.The owner wants to use the bottom floor for daycare(over 2 1/2 years of age)Approx 40 children and the top floor as a single family dwelling.I am trying to figure out how to make this mixed occupancy work.Two different codes are involved,residential and building.We had engineered plans for daycare but this has changed the way we look at it.Any help would be appreciated.
 
Lets see we start with accessibility--- parking, ramps, door, widths access to the primary function space of the daycare. Then we add separate toilet rooms for each gender on the daycare floor. Under 50 occupants, so no fire alarms required. Sprinklers are required throughout due to the the residential use not that is not a one or two family dwelling (VA ammendments). If was a bedroom on the first floor then sturctural evaluation required (40 vs 30 psf). A 1 hour including supporting construction fire separation is required between the daycare and the residence both dwelling unit separation and mixed use for 1 story height restriction on E use. Dwelling unit needs exit that does not pass throught the daycare. Will need to arrange electrical systems so both occupancies have access to their overcurrent devices without going into the other. Planning will have issues with parking and possibly if daycare is allowed in that residential district. Utilities may have connection fee issues. If designed for 12 or less children can call it a family day home and is considered R-5 use and none of the above is needed.
 
WOW!.....That was good....and fast......

Frank said:
Lets see we start with accessibility--- parking, ramps, door, widths access to the primary function space of the daycare. Then we add separate toilet rooms for each gender on the daycare floor. Under 50 occupants, so no fire alarms required. Sprinklers are required throughout due to the the residential use not that is not a one or two family dwelling (VA ammendments). If was a bedroom on the first floor then sturctural evaluation required (40 vs 30 psf). A 1 hour including supporting construction fire separation is required between the daycare and the residence both dwelling unit separation and mixed use for 1 story height restriction on E use. Dwelling unit needs exit that does not pass throught the daycare. Will need to arrange electrical systems so both occupancies have access to their overcurrent devices without going into the other. Planning will have issues with parking and possibly if daycare is allowed in that residential district. Utilities may have connection fee issues. If designed for 12 or less children can call it a family day home and is considered R-5 use and none of the above is needed.
Click to expand...
 
steveray said:
You mean 5B?
Click to expand...
Could well be III-B dwelling alot of homes in this area were built with true brick or block exterior bearing walls from the 1670s through around 1970. Interior would be plaster direct on the inside of the brick later furred drywall. Went out of favor when energy became a concern in the 70s.
 
$ = = = = = $

Also, ...don't forget the appropriate, ADA compliant, "child sized" plbg. fixtures

throughout !.............Check the age ranges involved.

$ = = = = = $
 
Frank said:
Could well be III-B dwelling alot of homes in this area were built with true brick or block exterior bearing walls from the 1670s through around 1970. Interior would be plaster direct on the inside of the brick later furred drywall. Went out of favor when energy became a concern in the 70s.
Click to expand...
He did say unprotected...I assumed unrated.....IIIB would have rated exterior....Correct?
 
Funny but true north star, we are in the process of getting a day care center approved by all departments for their final, and let me tell you, there is no way I would be able to use a children's toilet, boy are they low to the ground:)
 
Non-separated uses per 508.3?

Is the IEBC adopted in VA? If so you should look there it might be more forgiving then what Frank posted
 
$ = = = = $



" ...and let me tell you, there is no way I would be able to use a children's toilet, boy are they low to the ground :smile: "
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Never say never Mr. Chad !.......When The Doody Train is rolling at full speed, ...you mightjust be surprised at where you can go. :-o





$ = = = = $
 
Last edited by a moderator:
steveray said:
He did say unprotected...I assumed unrated.....IIIB would have rated exterior....Correct?
Click to expand...
The classic brick or block exterior wall was the model for the 2 hour noncombustible requirement. For structural reasons the wall is atleast 8 inches thick and may be as much as 36 in taller structures with heavier loads. Old City Hall in Richmond VA is an example of a classic 4 story IIIB building with true stone walls for the exterior--some up to 3 ft thick.

http://www.bluffton.edu/~sullivanm/virginia/richmond/cityhall/cityhall.html
 
Chad Pasquini said:
Funny but true north star, we are in the process of getting a day care center approved by all departments for their final, and let me tell you, there is no way I would be able to use a children's toilet, boy are they low to the ground:)
Click to expand...
Never made yellow snow???
 
waiting on answers,

But it sounds like

1. commercial building

2. wants to change occupancy

3. day care

4. residentail

Sound about right???

do they sprinkle in Virgina???
 
I agree whole heartily with CDA. It appears to be a change in use from a single-family dwelling regulated by the IRC to a mixed-use commercial BUILDING regulated by the IBC. There are not two codes involved, only one, the IBC.
 
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