1. Welcome to the new and improved Building Code Forum. We appreciate you being here and hope that you are getting the information that you need concerning all codes of the building trades. This is a free forum to the public due to the generosity of the Sawhorses, Corporate Supporters and Supporters who have upgraded their accounts. If you would like to have improved access to the forum please upgrade to Sawhorse by clicking here: Upgrades
    Dismiss Notice

Supreme Court Allows the Blind to Sue Retailers over Websites

Discussion in 'Accessibility' started by jar546, Oct 7, 2019.

  1. jar546

    jar546 *****istrator

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2009
    Messages:
    7,085
    Likes Received:
    530
    WASHINGTON —



    The Supreme Court cleared the way Monday for blind people to sue Domino’s Pizza and other retailers if their websites are not accessible to these people.

    In a potentially far-reaching move, the justices turned down an appeal from Domino’s and let stand a 9th Circuit Court of Appeals ruling holding that the Americans With Disabilities Act protects access not just to restaurants and stores, but also to the websites and apps of those businesses.

    Guillermo Robles, who is blind, filed suit in Los Angeles three years ago and complained he had been unable to order a pizza online because the Domino’s website lacked the software that would allow him to communicate. He cited the ADA, which guarantees to persons with a disability “full and equal enjoyment the goods and services ... of any place of public accommodations.”

    Lawyers for Domino’s agreed this provision applied to its pizza stores, but not its website.

    Last year, however, the 9th Circuit ruled for Robles and said the law applied to its online services as well as the store.

    “The ADA mandates that places of public accommodation, like Domino’s, provide auxiliary aids and services to make visual materials available to individuals who are blind,” the appeals court said in January.

    The U.S. Chamber of Commerce and business groups who said they represented 500,000 restaurants and 300,000 businesses joined in an appeal urging the high court to review the 9th Circuit’s decision. They said they feared a “tsunami of litigation,” and worried that judges nationwide would see the appeals court’s decision as “imposing a nationwide website-accessibility mandate.”

    But without comment or dissent on Monday, the high court said it would not hear the case of Domino’s Pizza vs. Robles.

    This is not a formal ruling upholding the 9th Circuit decision, and the justices could agree to take up the issue later if lower courts are divided.

    But for now, the court’s action strongly suggests that retailers will be required to make their websites accessible.


    https://www.latimes.com/politics/story/2019-10-07/blind-person-dominos-ada-supreme-court-disabled
     
  2. Ty J.

    Ty J. Sawhorse

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2017
    Messages:
    646
    Likes Received:
    262
    This will open a tremendous amount of litigation... wow.
     
  3. e hilton

    e hilton Bronze Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2014
    Messages:
    459
    Likes Received:
    110
    Not sure i understand ... dominos website lacked the software? Can someone explain how this is supposed to work?
     
  4. Keystone

    Keystone Sawhorse

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2010
    Messages:
    819
    Likes Received:
    107
    Audio will need to be added to aps and websites.
    Think of the audio as a listen device required up within the building code.

    Side note, persons legally blind may still have a portion of his/her eye site.

    This decision will open the flood gates, what about websites that do not have the capability of ordering food but requiring communicating with another individual for reselling purposes, eBay, Amazon, Facebook Marketplace, Craigslist, AirBnB, etc...... Let the lawsuits begin and arguments be heard, the Supreme Court will take it up once the differing of lower court ruling have been made.

    Although is it that unreasonable to have such a requirement, likely not.
     
  5. mark handler

    mark handler Sawhorse

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2009
    Messages:
    10,281
    Likes Received:
    761
    People have been warned, they all think they are exempt.
     
    jar546 likes this.
  6. Rick18071

    Rick18071 Sawhorse

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2009
    Messages:
    2,148
    Likes Received:
    255
    Next will be requirements for computer keyboards (and screens?) need to be in braille.
     
  7. mark handler

    mark handler Sawhorse

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2009
    Messages:
    10,281
    Likes Received:
    761
    They have overlays and full on braille keyboards already

    upload_2019-10-8_11-4-16.png
     
  8. fatboy

    fatboy Administrator

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2009
    Messages:
    5,781
    Likes Received:
    567
    Amazing...……..The courts won't be able to keep up.

    I guess the option is to shut down websites.
     
  9. mtlogcabin

    mtlogcabin Sawhorse

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2009
    Messages:
    7,423
    Likes Received:
    875
    There are already reminder keys to get your fingers properly positioned without looking at the keyboard. A good typist never looks at the keyboard while typing

    "The small bumps or ridges found on the F and J keys on a computer keyboard are to help users correctly position their left and right hands without having to look at the keyboard. For example, without looking at your hands, you can feel the correct position of your left index finger on the F and the right index finger on the J by feeling the small bumps on the keys. Once you're hands are on the home row key position, you should be able to locate the remainder of the keys on the keyboard.

    Tip
    The number 5 on keyboards with a numeric keypad also has a bump to help position your hand on the key pad."
     
  10. tmurray

    tmurray Sawhorse

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2011
    Messages:
    1,681
    Likes Received:
    447
    There is software bundled in Microsoft Windows that reads the screen for you. I would imagine a similar application is available for Apple.

    There are actually lots of accessibility features included in every Windows computer.
     
  11. Ty J.

    Ty J. Sawhorse

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2017
    Messages:
    646
    Likes Received:
    262
    That is correct, but what websites must now do is include the coding for the Windows Accessibility Platform to pull the information from the website. All too often, websites use images in place of actual text via coding.
     
  12. Yikes

    Yikes Gold Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2009
    Messages:
    1,466
    Likes Received:
    172
    Speculating here: the big firms will take advantage of this as a form of "rent seeking" with a goal towards reducing competition. They will have the technical and coding resources to keep up with these court rulings, while the little guys will find it too onerous to comply.

    A long time ago, one of my clients was a very large solid waste disposal company. It was founded by lawyers and accountants. They lobbied for regulatory agencies to pass environmental protections that required significant paperwork to verify compliance. Once these laws passed, they went around to the mom-and-pop companies and convinced them to sell their company to this new entity, rather than be buried in all the new paperwork. This strategy was wildly successful in forcing the small companies to sell to the conglomerate.
     
  13. mtlogcabin

    mtlogcabin Sawhorse

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2009
    Messages:
    7,423
    Likes Received:
    875
    And that is why major corporations donate to both political parties. So they will assure the ones in power will do their bidding for them to get regulations passed that will eliminate or restrict their competition through government regulations all in the name of protecting the "General Welfare" of the public. Heck it is even in the building codes we regulate.

    101.3 Intent.
    The purpose of this code is to establish the minimum requirements to safeguard the public health, safety and general welfare
     
  14. tmurray

    tmurray Sawhorse

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2011
    Messages:
    1,681
    Likes Received:
    447
    Wouldn't it just pull the <alt> tag associated with that image? Assuming there is one of course...
     
  15. Ty J.

    Ty J. Sawhorse

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2017
    Messages:
    646
    Likes Received:
    262
    Yes, but many website developers don't have the foresight to name the images with an appropriate description.

    Really, it is fairly easy to make a web-page friendly to those with visual impairments. Just takes more experience, foresight and planning, and bit of know how.
     
  16. my250r11

    my250r11 Sawhorse

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2015
    Messages:
    563
    Likes Received:
    158
    Jar, is our forum safe from this issue?
     
  17. mtlogcabin

    mtlogcabin Sawhorse

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2009
    Messages:
    7,423
    Likes Received:
    875
    It will be once he removes the Classified Section section since it seems to be limited to retailers right now
     
    my250r11 likes this.
  18. Ty J.

    Ty J. Sawhorse

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2017
    Messages:
    646
    Likes Received:
    262
  19. mark handler

    mark handler Sawhorse

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2009
    Messages:
    10,281
    Likes Received:
    761
    The web site needs to be interactive so the Blind, with whatever input device, knows where to type the info.
    Don't worry about his/her keyboard, worry about where to type it.
    Where do you put your name?
    Where do you type your address?
    What are you ordering?
    ????
     

Share This Page