• Welcome to The Building Code Forum

    Your premier resource for building code knowledge.

    This forum remains free to the public thanks to the generous support of our Sawhorse Members and Corporate Sponsors. Their contributions help keep this community thriving and accessible.

    Want enhanced access to expert discussions and exclusive features? Learn more about the benefits here.

    Ready to upgrade? Log in and upgrade now.

Switchgear Replacement (Real Life)

Apparently, NFPA will allow you to view any NEC edition for free from 1968 - current. 1968 working clearances here. I doubt it was different in 1958, but don't have any books in our archive older than 1971, and the 1958 area books are not available for free.



Screenshot 2025-10-16 132856.pngScreenshot 2025-10-16 132925.png
 

Attachments

  • 1760639692517.png
    1760639692517.png
    322.7 KB · Views: 0
An approval in 1958 does not mean it was code-compliant in 1958. Believe it or not, there are inspectors who approve stuff that is not code-compliant all the time.
Well I'll drag some more. The equipment was not a code violation in 1958. Odds are slim that there is a record of an inspection and approval... but let's assume that there is written proof that all was fine in 1958. Now there is a plan to replace the vintage equipment with contemporary equipment however, there is no way to do that in the space allotted without violating 110.26 Working Space... Do you allow that?
 
Well I'll drag some more. The equipment was not a code violation in 1958. Odds are slim that there is a record of an inspection and approval... but let's assume that there is written proof that all was fine in 1958. Now there is a plan to replace the vintage equipment with contemporary equipment however, there is no way to do that in the space allotted without violating 110.26 Working Space... Do you allow that?
Yes...as long as they do not make it "worse"....

701.2 Conformance.​

An existing building or portion thereof shall not be altered such that the building becomes less safe than its existing condition.

Exception: Where the current level of safety or sanitation is proposed to be reduced, the portion altered shall conform to the requirements of the International Building Code.

Section​


406.1Material.​

Existing electrical wiring and equipment undergoing repair shall be allowed to be repaired or replaced with like material.
 
Well I'll drag some more. The equipment was not a code violation in 1958. Odds are slim that there is a record of an inspection and approval... but let's assume that there is written proof that all was fine in 1958. Now there is a plan to replace the vintage equipment with contemporary equipment however, there is no way to do that in the space allotted without violating 110.26 Working Space... Do you allow that?
Funny you should ask.

Old equipment for the 2083ph 1600A Service Disconnect had a clearance of 30" and the new gear will make it 28" plus we are now in a flood zone. What do you do?
 
Well I'll drag some more. The equipment was not a code violation in 1958. Odds are slim that there is a record of an inspection and approval... but let's assume that there is written proof that all was fine in 1958. Now there is a plan to replace the vintage equipment with contemporary equipment however, there is no way to do that in the space allotted without violating 110.26 Working Space... Do you allow that?
I wouldn't, unless it was close to right. Electricians now are not the same as electricians then. Equipment now is not the same as equipment then. Today's equipment will probably be larger than the old equipment. It's dangerous to work on, and it's going to stay that way for the next 60 years until we rinse and repeat.

What is the voltage? If we have 480 in there, that would become an adamant no.

Edit, saw previous post. 28" to 208v does not terrify me as much as other possible scenarios. Will they be able to get the equipment doors open? It's still making the working space worse.
 
Funny you should ask.

Old equipment for the 2083ph 1600A Service Disconnect had a clearance of 30" and the new gear will make it 28" plus we are now in a flood zone. What do you do?
What is the potential voltage to ground for any single phase of a 208 volt three phase electrical service?
To determine the potential voltage to ground for any single phase of a 208-volt three-phase electrical service, we need to consider the configuration of the three-phase system. A 208-volt three-phase service is typically associated with a wye (Y) configuration, where the line-to-line voltage is 208 volts, and the voltage from each phase to the neutral (or ground, if the neutral is grounded) can be calculated.In a wye-connected three-phase system, the line-to-neutral voltage (also called phase-to-neutral voltage) is related to the line-to-line voltage by the formula:
Vphase-to-neutral=Vline-to-line3V_{\text{phase-to-neutral}} = \frac{V_{\text{line-to-line}}}{\sqrt{3}}V_{\text{phase-to-neutral}} = \frac{V_{\text{line-to-line}}}{\sqrt{3}}
Given:
  • Line-to-line voltage = 208 volts
  • 3≈1.732\sqrt{3} \approx 1.732\sqrt{3} \approx 1.732
Vphase-to-neutral=2083≈2081.732≈120 voltsV_{\text{phase-to-neutral}} = \frac{208}{\sqrt{3}} \approx \frac{208}{1.732} \approx 120 \, \text{volts}V_{\text{phase-to-neutral}} = \frac{208}{\sqrt{3}} \approx \frac{208}{1.732} \approx 120 \, \text{volts}
Therefore, the potential voltage to ground for any single phase of a 208-volt three-phase electrical service, assuming a wye configuration with a grounded neutral, is approximately 120 volts.Note: This assumes a standard wye-connected system with a grounded neutral, which is common in 208V three-phase services (e.g., 208Y/120V systems). If the system is a delta configuration or ungrounded, the voltage to ground may not be well-defined or could differ, and additional information about the system grounding would be needed. If you have a specific configuration in mind (e.g., delta or corner-grounded delta), please clarify, and I can provide a more tailored answer.

That being said, conditions 1,2,3 require 36" clearance in front. Your situation goes from bad (30") to worse (28"). That is a reduction of 22.2%. I already said that the flood problem is risk worth taking.
I would not approve the proposed equipment, even at 30" clearance much less 28". But that's easy for me to say in that I worked for LA County and there is always someone that will approve it if they complain to the right people.
 
Something that can be done could be they could simply build a structure adjacent to this and attach it to the building like a small addition and create a properly sized electrical room and turn the existing room into a wall full of junction boxes.
This makes sense. Is it necessary that the gear be in a room at all? Is there a reason they can’t rework the service from the vault so it runs to the proposed new area/ room and eliminates the need for the junction box wall? I’m a big fan of not having service conductors inside, as I’m sure you guys are too.
 
Back
Top