Top 4 floors, Fire Stair, Type IA building- Can we close off the top 4 floors

[cda]

I want to say no, yes

Seems like you would need fire dept approval, even if not a code issue

 

[peach]

It may be convenient for the tenant of the top 4 floors; but not a very secure option for them.

 

[texasbo]

Guys and Gals: how are you justifying this with 1008.1.8.7, 2006 IBC (short of, as I said in my earlier post, complying with 403)?

 

[Builder Bob]

403.12 Stairway door operation. Stairway doors other than the exit discharge doors shall be permitted to be locked from stairway side. Stairway doors that are locked from the stairway

side shall be capable of being unlocked simultaneously without unlatching upon a signal from the fire command center.

I beleive the magnetic card reader option may be the only code complaint suggestion I have seen thus far.............. a barrier in a stairway is not allowed except in one case, where the stairway continues beyond the point of exit discharge and you have to direct them to the exit discharge - but you cannot make the exit not readily acceesible for immediate use......

 

[cda]

That is the problem I have, putting a door actualy in the stair way

 

[miguele3]

Thanks all. The fire official killed it today by saying he doesn't even want a delay for fireman by having to deal with a door. Thanks again for all your help.

 

[cda]

Way to go fire dept

Just some security on the existing doors, if they want to limit access

Why do they think the employees will be running up and down the stairs constantly ????

 

[mtlogcabin]

Thanks all. The fire official killed it today by saying he doesn't even want a delay for fireman by having to deal with a door. Thanks again for all your help.

They have to deal with a door at every level but HE doesn't like this idea. Did he give you a code section to back it up?

 

[AegisFPE]

how are you justifying this with 1008.1.8.7, 2006 IBC

Exception 3 includes "stairways serving not more than four stories..." There are places in the code where there is a specific datum, such as "above grade" or "above the lowest level of fire department access," but this exception does not appear to preclude application to 4 stories at the top of a tall building (subject to the other conditions of the exception).<>

Granted a strict interpretation could find that the stairway does serve more than 4 stories, even though the subject door (for which this provision is intended to apply) serves only 4 stories when measured in the direction of egress travel. However, the code probably does not anticipate such a door in the exit enclosure, though similar barriers are permitted (such as to prevent travel below the level of exit discharge), so it would seem that some agreement of an acceptable alternate methods approach could be achieved.

 

[cda]

Code does not address every situation

But I do not believe I have walked up or down a stair enclosure and encountered a door in the stairway itself

Just seems wrong in many ways

 

[miguele3]

Doesn't the code give the AHJ ultimate say. If this AHJ tells me this, I listen. The client wants to promote stair use. The client wants to do it without card readers and maintain security...I tried, but I respect and understand the decision and the Fire Official is top notch. An interstitial stair would be tricky as we have post-tensioned slabs.