Yet Another Pier/Beam Related Foundation Question

[MtnDon]

Background: As I mentioned in my intro post just now, I am an administrator on a DIY owner-builder cabin building forum. I don't own the site; I just hang out there too much. I am not a professional builder or inspector but do have some knowledge as to what codes state about various things. I've referenced the IRC a lot and I read the footnotes, too.

I know that the IRC does not list pier & beam as a prescribed/approved foundation. That however has little to no effect on many of the DIY owner-builders that frequent our forum. At times I get so frustrated :banghd trying to convince someone that there is good reason to have building codes and good reason to use them as directions on the better way, the proper way, to build things. All the more so when they show up showing off their project sitting on 4x4 posts with at least one side 5, 6 feet and more above grade.

Anyone have some good arguments to be used for those DIY owner-builders who happen to find themselves in an area where codes are not enforced or those who just plain don't give a darn?

I have to plead guilty to having built a 16x30 cabin on ten 6x6 PT piers myself. That was before I knew better. In my defense let me add that I did use foundation grade 6x6, they are 44 to 46 inches in the ground, on poured in place concrete footers, have rebar, and only protrude 12 1/2 to 13 inches above grade.

Thanks to all who may have any thoughts/ideas.

 

[MtnDon]

I put this here as foundation issues are common.

 

[Daddy-0-]

Depends on what and where you are building. Pier construction is fairly common in coastal areas. If it falls outside of the IRC, an engineer can often provide the design. A more specific question may get more answers. Welcome...

 

[Mark K]

The basic problem has to do with those individuals who are contemptious of codes.

On small buildings it is relatively easy to build something that stands up. This can give individuals a false sense that they know what they are doing. What they apparently do not recognize is the fact that the non-compliant building will often have problems later that may shorten the life of the building or create hazards for the occupants. Heavy snows, high wind, and large earthquakes have a way of causing problems for these structures.

Unconventional foundations and foundations on poor soil are likely to cause problems that can tear the building apart.

My guess is that many of these know it all individuals are really incompetant. It has been reported that incompetatnt individuals are blind to their own ignorance and have great confidence that they know what they are doing. Thus they are not receptive to logic and there is probably nothing you can do to change that attitude. In areas of strict enforcement these individuals will either moderate their behavior or will become the homeowner from hell who bootlegs construction and when caught resists enforcement efforts.

 

[Sifu]

It has been reported that incompetatnt individuals are blind to their own ignorance and have great confidence that they know what they are doing. Thus they are not receptive to logic and there is probably nothing you can do to change that attitude.

Wonderfully put. I am going to borrow that.

 

[Francis Vineyard]

Anyone have some good arguments to be used for those DIY owner-builders who happen to find themselves in an area where codes are not enforced or those who just plain don't give a darn?

In my experience the insurance if required usually denies claims for non-permitted work and structures. Results vary with the amount of liability and the adjusters determination.

Francis

 

[Mac]

"It has been reported that incompetatnt individuals are blind to their own ignorance and have great confidence that they know what they are doing.'

Yeah, people don't realize how much they don't know!

 

[codeworks]

mtndon, is your first cabin still standing? that'll speak for itself. i was raised in vermont, where frost goes deep (5 feet in some places, more so if there is an "open" winter) , that means no snow to insulate ther ground. we always went below frost with footings, and built walls for log homes the same thickness as the logs. 8" being the minimum wall thickness, but if one uses 10" logs, a 10 wall was built. there are only 5 "local" jurisdictions, that regulate residential construction, some boot leg, but for the most part, what i saw and was involved with was good quality , even with out permits and inspectors, it depends on the individuals i reckon. and how long one wants to keep working in a small state. good reputations last a long time, so do bad ones

 

[fireguy]

"It has been reported that incompetatnt individuals are blind to their own ignorance and have great confidence that they know what they are doing.'Yeah, people don't realize how much they don't know!

At the fire house the saying was "He is so ignerant, he don't know how ignerant he is"

 

[MikeC]

I saw this posted somewhere about a year ago. I have been holding onto it waiting for that perfect moment.

When one fails to recognize that he or she has performed poorly, the individual is left assuming that they have performed well. As a result, the incompetent will tend to grossly overestimate their skills and abilities

 

[righter101]

I saw this posted somewhere about a year ago. I have been holding onto it waiting for that perfect moment.When one fails to recognize that he or she has performed poorly, the individual is left assuming that they have performed well. As a result, the incompetent will tend to grossly overestimate their skills and abilities

That is getting posted in the break room. thanks.