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All doors out of a bldg required to be code compliant exits?

And this is why DPs get so frustrated with BOs. Just keep arguing a stupid point instead of admitting you're wrong.

The code can't get more clear. If you have a door that goes outside what else would you use it for? The intent is evident, the language is unambiguous. No landings required either?? And if it's more than 30" to grade on the other side, no problem according to another thread about windows.
The code provision appears to be limited to doors that are provided for egress.

The only person who can tell me the purpose for the door is the designer. As the AHJ, I can only hypothesize to the reason for the door.
 
There are doors that are not permitted to be part of the means of egress
4. Egress shall not pass through kitchens, storage rooms,
 
Isn't the door to a storage room or kitchen the means of egress for occupants of the storage room or kitchen, and thus those doors have to comply?
 
I feel like people are getting stuck on the fact that on some rare occasion, someone could possible use any exterior door for egress and finding that it needs to comply based on that. However, based on that logic, overhead doors would likely need to comply as well. Maybe even some windows.

What if, what if, what if...
 
I never knew this. What code sections limit the amount or location of non-side hinged doors?

Would a exterior side hinged door that only goes to a balcony need to follow the "means of egress" sections?
For instance....And of course there are others in 1010, 9 in this particular section...

1010.1.2 Door swing. Egress doors shall be of the pivoted
or side-hinged swinging type.
Exceptions:
1. Private garages, office areas, factory and storage
areas with an occupant load of 10 or less.

2. Group I-3 occupancies used as a place of detention.
3. Critical or intensive care patient rooms within
suites of health care facilities.
4. Doors within or serving a single dwelling unit in
Groups R-2 and R-3.
 
I feel like people are getting stuck on the fact that on some rare occasion, someone could possible use any exterior door for egress and finding that it needs to comply based on that. However, based on that logic, overhead doors would likely need to comply as well. Maybe even some windows.

What if, what if, what if...
What if...WTF...Whatever... :p
 
A little bit of thread drift bringing in the accessibility at this point...Doors other than side hinge are allowed in specific limited cases....
There's a whole lot of drift on this thread, because the original poster has not provided sufficient information.
  • The post is in the "accessibility" forum, which leads us to believe that it might be a question about accessibility. But the essence of the question in post #1 was unclear as to whether it was about life-safety means of egress, or about accessibility.
  • The OP did not say where the project is located, so we don't know the applicable code or authority having jurisdiction.
  • The OP did not say whether it was a code / plan check issue, or whether there was a concern about ADA civil enforcement / lawsuits.
In post #5, I encouraged the OP to provide this information, but saw no response. So we're all going on whatever tangent interests us most.
 
Lets start with only 2 MOE (from an area) need to be accessible by the IBC

1009.1 Accessible means of egress required. Accessible
means of egress shall comply with this section. Accessible
spaces shall be provided with not less than one accessible
means of egress. Where more than one means of egress are
required by Section 1006.2 or 1006.3 from any accessible
space, each accessible portion of the space shall be served by
not less than two accessible means of egress.

When they are not an AMOE they they need signage to the AMOE...

1111.2 Directional signage. Directional signage indicating
the route to the nearest like accessible element shall be provided

at the following locations. These directional signs shall
include the International Symbol of Accessibility and sign
characters shall meet the visual character requirements in
accordance with ICC A117.1.
1. Inaccessible building entrances.
2. Inaccessible public toilets and bathing facilities.
3. Elevators not serving an accessible route.
4. At each separate-sex toilet and bathing room indicating
the location of the nearest family/assisted use toilet or
bathing room where provided in accordance with Section
1109.2.1.
5. At exits and exit stairways serving a required accessible
space, but not providing an approved accessible means
of egress, signage shall be provided in accordance with
Section 1009.10.
Code may not be "less accessible" then ADA minimums, no?
Both code "and" law applies to owners
 
If that tweaks you out look at this garbage from IBC commentary:

While there are no dispersement requirements
specific to accessible means of egress or travel distance
limitations
where there is not an area of refuge
requirement (see Sections 1009.3, 1009.4 and
1009.6), the code requires all exits to be distinct, separate
and independent. The main intent is that a person
with mobility impairments will always have
options. If not all exits are accessible, possible
entrapment should be a consideration in determining
which exits are to be made accessible.
 
Not unless it is signed as an exit door

View attachment 8286
Isn't a path out of every room required for egress? Doesn't a door from every storage room and every kitchen have to comply with code for egress, even if an exit access door? Maybe no sign, no rating, inswing, and perhaps it doesn't have to be accessible, but there are code requirements at least for size, force to open, landings, and maybe more. I believe the code requires a m.o.e. for all occupants.
 
Not unless it is signed as an exit door

View attachment 8286
Thanks mtlogcabin for this. This doesn't mention doors that are not marked as exit doors so if unmarked they do not need to comply with this section.

in a building with an occupancy is less then 50 you don't need exit signs. So if only 1 exit is required in this building and there is 2 exterior doors and no exit signs and one door does not meet code as an exit because it is locked from the outside how does a person know which door to exit the building?
 
So there is a minimum requirement for door count out of a space but say your building has 12 doors to the exterior (assume warehouse with several convenience doors) and only (2) are required by code for exiting. Do you find in some jurisdictions that you are required to make all of those doors code compliant exits... with signage and access to public way/area of refuge?
See IFC/IBC 2018 1010.1 where doors installed greater in number that is required must still comply with the egress requirements. Also, see 2018 IFC 504 access to buildings for fire department use.
 
See IFC/IBC 2018 1010.1 where doors installed greater in number that is required must still comply with the egress requirements. Also, see 2018 IFC 504 access to buildings for fire department use.

Same in the IBC and the point of debate.....

1010.1 Doors. Means of egress doors shall meet the requirements
of this section. Doors serving a means of egress system
shall meet the requirements of this section and Section
1022.2. Doors provided for egress purposes in numbers
greater than required by this code shall meet the requirements
of this section.
 
See IFC/IBC 2018 1010.1 where doors installed greater in number that is required must still comply with the egress requirements. Also, see 2018 IFC 504 access to buildings for fire department use.
See, that's the thing. It is not required for all doors. Just those provided for egress purposes. It would be helpful to look at a slightly modified version of the clause to compare what is likely the original intent.

1022.2. Doors provided for egress purposes in numbers greater than required by this code shall meet the requirements of this section.
- this means that doors provided for egress purposes must comply even if they are in excess of the minimum number.

1022.2. Doors provided in numbers greater than required by this code shall meet the requirements of this section.
- this would mean that all doors must comply.

Given the bolded section in Steveray's post, we can only conclude that it was the author's intention to limit the application of this clause in the manner stated and not to apply it to all doors. Of course any door could be used for egress, but as to the original intent of the door, what it was provided for, only the designer can answer if the door is provided for egress purposes or not.

We would all be best served to have the designer clearly indicate what doors a provided for egress purposes on their plans.
 
Isn't a path out of every room required for egress? Doesn't a door from every storage room and every kitchen have to comply with code for egress, even if an exit access door? Maybe no sign, no rating, inswing, and perhaps it doesn't have to be accessible, but there are code requirements at least for size, force to open, landings, and maybe more. I believe the code requires a m.o.e. for all occupants.
Not sure how it is there, but here the means of egress is the whole of the path from inside the building to the outside (safe area). There are components of the means of egress that include access to exits and exits themselves. Sometimes doors out of spaces need to comply with more stringent requirements based on what hazards are present in the building and/or how many people.

For instance, who cares if the door to a small janitor's closet swings in. But the doors from a large theater to the lobby? Definitely should apply some requirements to door swing there.
 
I just watched a 48 Hours show on the Rhode Island Station Fire 18 years later
and it was interesting how the owners insisted the door next to the stage was not an egress door yet the fire marshal and prosecuting attorney deemed it was (it opened inward). Maybe because it had an exit sign above it and that is how the band got out. The fire marshal only cited that the door had to be removed which if the owners had complied it just may have prevented the band from surviving.
 
I could never see ordering a door removed.....Exit sign yes, but not a door....Work won't let me open that link, so I will have to check it from home...Good one to show to the new folks I assume...
 
It's not a legal exit so you cannot advertise it as such......

1013.1 Where required. Exits and exit access doors shall be
marked by an approved exit sign readily visible from any
direction of egress travel.
 
Anyone suggest what purposes a door, much like those intended for egress, is intended for if not for egress? As a designer, I can just see the building officials reaction to "that door is not intended for egress, it's only for ventilation or the view (in a warehouse) or for Uber eats deliveries. Would you allow key key deadbolts even?
 
Anyone suggest what purposes a door, much like those intended for egress, is intended for if not for egress? As a designer, I can just see the building officials reaction to "that door is not intended for egress, it's only for ventilation or the view (in a warehouse) or for Uber eats deliveries. Would you allow key key deadbolts even?
Access? general circulation?.....Yes
 
It's not a legal exit so you cannot advertise it as such......

1013.1 Where required. Exits and exit access doors shall be
marked by an approved exit sign readily visible from any
direction of egress travel.
This only says exit are to be marked. Still it does not say when a door is not an exit it shall not be marked as an exit.
 
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