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Fire Rated Electrical Rooms in a Medical Office Building

arwat23

arwat23

SAWHORSE
Joined
Sep 19, 2023
Messages
443
Location
California
In California, are there any requirements to have an electrical room be fire rated in a single-story medical office building?

The entire building is occupied by a single tenant. Construction is V-B, Group B occupancy for the whole building. The electrical room is accessed from the exterior and is small compared to the rest of the building (less than 5% of the entire building area). There's a few electrical panels, a transformer (which should meet the exception in CEC 450.21), a switchboard, and a lighting panel. Not in WUI.

I haven't been able to find anything in code that says the electrical room needs to be fire rated. Based on other posts I've seen, it doesn't seem like it is required to be rated. However, I wanted to double check because the city is pushing back hard on this, demanding rated walls and ceiling, but won't provide any code reference.
 
Do they think it's a "machinery room" because they haven't read the definition IBC?
 
steveray said:
NFPA 99?
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I could be wrong, but I don't think so. NFPA 99 doesn't appear to be applicable for this project based on what I see (I could be missing something tbh though), and our DPH (and OSHPD/HCAI) doesn't have jurisdiction over this project, so their unique requirements aren't applicable.
 
Beniah Naylor said:
Do they think it's a "machinery room" because they haven't read the definition IBC?
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I'll be honest, I don't see a definition for "machinery room" in IBC or CBC. They've been calling it an electrical room though (which is what I've been calling it as in my plans), so not sure.
 
redeyedfly said:
They need to provide a code reference. That's why we have them.
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That's what I said too, but they simply won't. They basically threatened the contractor saying something to the effect of "the more we look into this, the worse it gets for you. It's better to just design something and have us review it. We won't final this until the space is fire rated."

Basically, I either just blindly do what they say, which honestly I'm fine with - having a rated ceiling and wall isn't a bad thing, or try to prove we don't need to be spending extra time and budget on something that isn't required. Even if I just do what they tell me, I want to know what the requirements are so we don't get any comments.
 
arwat23 said:
That's what I said too, but they simply won't. They basically threatened the contractor saying something to the effect of "the more we look into this, the worse it gets for you. It's better to just design something and have us review it. We won't final this until the space is fire rated."

Basically, I either just blindly do what they say, which honestly I'm fine with - having a rated ceiling and wall isn't a bad thing, or try to prove we don't need to be spending extra time and budget on something that isn't required. Even if I just do what they tell me, I want to know what the requirements are so we don't get any comments.
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The owner should decide whether to push back or pay for what they are asking.

What rating? What type of wall?

If a BO told me they would make things worse if I kept asking for the code they claim I'm not following I would be on the phone with the Mayor's office immediately. Yes, even for a few sheets of gyp in one room. I often disagree with their determinations and have to decide if it's worth it to appeal, but this is very different. The BO's job is to enforce the code, not make it up as they go along.
 
redeyedfly said:
What rating? What type of wall?
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There's an existing wood stud wall and no ceiling. Wall was originally just exposed wood studs, but we're adding gyp. We're being told to make that wall a rated wall (not sure the rating requirements) and add a rated ceiling / make the roof rated. We're also being told to add more ventilation that our engineers disagree with, but that's not my main concern right now.

Tenant is worried this will delay the project (which this probably would) and the building owner isn't getting involved. Cost isn't a major concern. It's more about the time.
 
Beniah Naylor said:
Do they think it's a "machinery room" because they haven't read the definition IBC?
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My bad, it's in the IMC definitions. The IBC only references it in Table 509.1 Incidental Uses.

Machinery Room - An enclosed space that is required by chapter 11 to contain refrigeration equipment and to comply with Sections 1105 and 1106.

Doesn't sound like that is your problem though...
 
Beniah Naylor said:
My bad, it's in the IMC definitions. The IBC only references it in Table 509.1 Incidental Uses.

Machinery Room - An enclosed space that is required by chapter 11 to contain refrigeration equipment and to comply with Sections 1105 and 1106.

Doesn't sound like that is your problem though...
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Definitely not. No refrigeration equipment.

Looking at Table 509.1, that references CEC for "electrical installations and transformers", it doesn't seem like this would require a rated separation.
 
arwat23 said:
There's an existing wood stud wall and no ceiling. Wall was originally just exposed wood studs, but we're adding gyp. We're being told to make that wall a rated wall (not sure the rating requirements) and add a rated ceiling / make the roof rated.
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If the walls go to the roof deck, there is certainly no reason to rate the roof deck...
 
If we can put breaker panel in hallways, why does the electrical room need to be rated?

Is there any where in the codes for any type of building that requires fire separation for electrical room? I am try to find the requirement for emergence electrical room to be to b 2 hour rated
 
steveray said:
If the walls go to the roof deck, there is certainly no reason to rate the roof deck...
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Walls go to roof deck, but (from what I've been told...) the inspector is asking for a rated ceiling or roof deck. This is why I'm confused. Makes me think that either the inspector is talking out of their ass, mistaken on what's required, or I'm missing something in code.
 
TheCommish said:
Is there any where in the codes for any type of building that requires fire separation for electrical room? I am try to find the requirement for emergence electrical room to be to b 2 hour rated
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The best I've found so far is if there's a vault in the electrical room it needs to be 3hr rated or if the transformer is a certain size (ours doesn't exceed the size listed in code) it needs to be 1hr rated.

This may be a silly question, but what's an "emergency electrical room"?
 
California code has a specification of {Special Room} but not listed in definitions. It requires fire rating. Other items not listed by op could be triggering the requirement.
 
Gregg Harris said:
California code has a specification of {Special Room} but not listed in definitions. It requires fire rating. Other items not listed by op could be triggering the requirement.
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What sections of code refer to "special rooms"?

If you need an exhaustive list, I got you:
  • Transformer (our engineer has confirmed that it meets the requirement of the exception for CEC 450.21)
  • A few electrical panels,
  • Main switchboard (800A),
  • MPOE for data,
  • A single light fixture with included 90-minute battery backup,
  • Unfinished / concrete floor,
  • A circuit breaker enclosure,
  • Lighting control panel,
  • Telephone board.
That's a complete list of every item going into that room.

Edit: If it makes a difference, the rooms immediately adjacent to the electrical room are an exam room (typical / generic - no special equipment in that room other than a adjustable exam table), a small storage room, and an office.
 
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In most scenarios electrical rooms do not require fire rating. If the building is sprinkled then the room requires sprinkling NFPA 13. If critical operation equipment in room rating required access from room into building etc. NEC 708

Ask again politely why they are asking for the rating. Assuming medical being in and out no overnight stay?
 
Emergency Electrical room has panelboards and supporting equipment that supplies power to exit signs, exit lighting and other essential functions of the building. A regular electric room supplies power to the rest of the building, which may or my not have generator power to all or some of the circuit.
 
Not sure about California, but IBC does not require electrical rooms to be fire rated. In past versions of the code, yes. It was dropped some time ago.

However, fire rating can be added so that you can omit sprinklers. Maybe California has something similar.
 
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