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Garden Roof

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Bootleg

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New SFR with a living/garden roof 2 in 12 pitch roof single story 10' from eve to grade.

Roof is easily accessible would the code require a guard rail?

If required can some kind of setback from edge of roof be done in the garden with shrubbery instead of guardrail to meet code?
 
OK, I'll play.........."easily accessable"?

How? Via stairs, roof hatch, door?

If it is designed to be utilized as a garden, then it really isn't any different than a deck, balconey etc. So yes, I could see a requirement for a guard. Don't know if I would by the landscape setback though.
 
2 in 12 pitch doesn't seem very "Accessible" to me. I would require guards just to keep from stumbling off the edge regardless of height above grade! I envision this "garden" party, with libations, of course - and guests dropping off the edge all night long.

Per the IRC, 2:12 is a ramp, so it would require handrails, landing, etc.!!!
 
If my roof required a lot of maintenance, I would want it to be easily accessible, too! If I go pull weeds (moss) out of my shingles, should I have a guard rail or permanent anchor for fall protection equipment installed? I don't think so. If I wanted to install such protection voluntarily (or some sort of alternative protection that made me feel better), I should be permitted to, but I do not see that it is necessarily required.

Strictly speaking, R312.1 applies to "porches, balconies, ramps or raised floor surfaces." Based on the slope, it may be most similar to a ramp, but the definition of a ramp begins, "A walking surface..." Hard to consider a roof covering (based on definition of a "covering applied to roof deck for appearance") a walking surface (undefined).
 
Let's be clear, at 2:12 it's a roof, not a deck or other outdoor living space...it's not like a person will be comfortable in a chair or standing on it for a long time.

Like any other roof, yes people can go up on it and drink if they are so "inclined."

Putting a rail around it is nonsense.
 
ah, the voice of reason.

Sorry, this isn't like any other roof, that yes, can be accessed by anyone wanting to do maintenance or drink or whatever. It has been designed and specified that it WILL be accessed for gardening, there WILL be people up there, it IS more than 30" above grade. Put a guard around it for a final inspection, no guard, no C.O. Or, get rid of the "garden". What you do after that is up to you.

And this is what happens when a designer draws a line in the sand..............
 
I will vote with those in favor of "NO guard rail."

I would hate to be the inspector who was sued because someone fell off of a a 2/12 roof without a guard rail when this project set a precedent for a guard rail.
 
I would hate to be the building inspector who was sued for NOT requiring the guard, when I had prior knowledge that the roof GARDEN was going to be regularly accessed, obviously for more than regular maintenance. The precedent would be, if you have a roof that you are accessing for more than maintenance of the roof itself, then a guard is required. See the Mechanical Code, they don't think professionals are capable of not falling off flat roofs, within 10'.
 
kind of dumb to build a garden roof on anything but a flat roof.. (don't we try to keep vegetation OFF of low slope roofs). The planting material is not going to improve the life of the roof). Really, I can't buy the concept.
 
fatboy said:
ah, the voice of reason.Sorry, this isn't like any other roof, that yes, can be accessed by anyone wanting to do maintenance or drink or whatever. It has been designed and specified that it WILL be accessed for gardening, there WILL be people up there, it IS more than 30" above grade. Put a guard around it for a final inspection, no guard, no C.O. Or, get rid of the "garden". What you do after that is up to you.

And this is what happens when a designer draws a line in the sand..............
Click to expand...
Used for gardening?

That's agriculture and exempt from the IBC.
 
fatboy said:
I would hate to be the building inspector who was sued for NOT requiring the guard, when I had prior knowledge that the roof GARDEN was going to be regularly accessed, obviously for more than regular maintenance. The precedent would be, if you have a roof that you are accessing for more than maintenance of the roof itself, then a guard is required. See the Mechanical Code, they don't think professionals are capable of not falling off flat roofs, within 10'.
Click to expand...
The OP said it was a "living/garden roof." These typically have plants selected for durability, low maintenance, and reduced energy use.

I don't see anything in the post that suggests the roof has been "designed and specified" for gardening.

I know it's takes less effort to say "No" than "Yes," but I didn't know that the greatest danger to the public was your being sued.
 
Look, I didn't bring up the suing issue, I was replying to George's comment. I have asked several times for more info on this "garden", specifically how it is accessed. That would be a critical piece for me to make a decision if a guard were required. If you noticed, my original reply stated that I could see the need for the guard. Based on the info we have been given at this point, yes, I would require it, erring on the side of caution, and safety. If one were to make a compelling argument that a guard wouldn't be required, I would listen to it.

And I didn't say no, I said yes.............
 
Until there is evidence to the contrary, it's a roof.

Instead of erring on the side of caution, etc. why not just get it right?
 
It's been stated that it is more than a roof, it's a roof garden. What does that mean? I don't know, but until evidence to the contrary IS presented, my assumption is it will be more than occaisionally accessed. As I said, no different than mechanical equipement having guard requirements...................

And, not to surprisingly, I really don't care if you think it's "right".
 
I'm unfamiliar with the code section about making worst case assumptions in lieu of reviewing what is presented. Is it in an appendix?
 
As presented, I'm on the side of a guard not being required. This slopes 2:12. That's not a floor surface of any kind. That's even too steep for a legal ramp. Roof gardens usually are planted with very low maintenance vegetation. Now if I was the architect, I'd have to look at more factors than what has been mentioned so far to determine what I felt should be done above and beyond the code (which I believe is no requirement).

I'll play devil's advocate: If a guard is required, what section of the code would control the height? Is it height as measured at the guard? A point within "x" feet of the guard (similar to parapet requirements).

If this was a low sloped roof, where would guards be required? Since regular access to roof, are guards required on the entire roof to make sure that person doesn't fall? Or only if garden surface is within 10' of an edge? What code sections would you recite for the requirement?

IMHO, as soon as you say a guard is required, you have to back up all these other situations with code sections that apply.
 
One needs to get past the term "roof garden" and ask for a narrative of what the activities are to be for the space.

If the garden is meant to be occupiable, as in occupied by people on a regular basis, and as a country bumpkin I assume that gardens require tending, then it requires a railing. If it is just a green roof that doesn't have vegi's or flowers that need watering, picking and tending, and there isn't a place intended for sittin' under a tree, then maybe no railing.
 
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IMHO, It is not required to have a guard rail. 2006 IRC Section R312.1 only requires guards for "porches, balconies, ramps or raised floor surfaces". I suppose one could argue that by planting a garden on a roof the roof becomes a "raised floor surface" but, I don't buy it. It is a roof. No guard required.

GPES
 
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